SunPower or LG?

[foo1bar]

OK, here is all I got,

33x Certainteed CT325HC11-04 panels w/ Enphase micro inverters, 10.725 KW system, $3.4/W
22x Panasonic-370-WHT panels w/ SolarEdge SE7600H-US, 8.14KW system, $3.91/W
25x REC 330W Alpha black panels w/ Enphase IQ7+ micro inverters, 8.25KW system, $3.15/W
30x Mission Solar 325W panels w/Enphase IQ7+ micro inverters, 9.75kW system, $2.8/W
25x SunPower A series 410W panels w/ SP interacted micro inverters, 10.25KW system, $3.94/W
28x LG NeonR 395W panels / SolarEdge SE10000H-US, 11.06KW system, $3.54/W

not sure if it's just me, but no luck of getting anywhere under $3.5/W with top name brands SunPower, Panasonic, LG, 30% lower would be $2.48/W for LG, or $2.76/W for SunPower.., anybody could get this price in NCal bay area please do let me know!

I plan to try if I can bargain on LG...but great suggestion on PVWatts, will definitely check that out! Thanks!

Can you fit 30 panels on your roof? (or 33?)

What size system do you need?

Assuming you need ~10kW, I'd probably email the guy with the REC, tell them you want a bigger system - like 28 panels at ~350W. But you're looking for the best price per watt as well.
Do you care if they're all black panels or not?
All black cost slightly more (not a lot more, but it adds up.

And I'd email the guy with the Mission Solar - tell him that you don't want Mission Solar - and which ones you're OK with.
(personally I'd be fine with Mission Solar. - but it's your money)
If you don't want 30 panels, you want 28 or 25 (at 345W-365W), you can tell him that too.

And when you're looking for companies, look at companies beyond the immediate bay area. I dealt with a company from Santa Cruz - they're gone now - I think they main guy retired. But they did decent work - and I think were cheaper than anyone based in the south bay.

[PugPower]

I like Panasonic and LG. I've never heard of the others you mentioned besides Sunpower. You should be able to get the LG panels and a SolarEdge system for around $3.00 per watt. LG panels are generally cheaper than Panasonic, but Panasonic are marginally better but IMO not enough to justify the price increase. Also, Solaredge is going to be cheaper than Enphase on a larger system. I wouldn't pay more than 30K for a 10kW system. Keep shopping around and Good luck!

[InmarketforPV]

I agree with JPM. Based on my research and experience (in S. Cali anyway) those quotes are at least 30% too high even for name brand panels. Maybe there is a price increase in materials that I am not aware of or maybe labor costs have increased. IMO it's just too much. Also from my experience installers generally under estimate the projected production so they can be sure to hit their guarantees. You should use PVWatts for a more accurate representation of your expected production.

OK, here is all I got,

33x Certainteed CT325HC11-04 panels w/ Enphase micro inverters, 10.725 KW system, $3.4/W
22x Panasonic-370-WHT panels w/ SolarEdge SE7600H-US, 8.14KW system, $3.91/W
25x REC 330W Alpha black panels w/ Enphase IQ7+ micro inverters, 8.25KW system, $3.15/W
30x Mission Solar 325W panels w/Enphase IQ7+ micro inverters, 9.75kW system, $2.8/W
25x SunPower A series 410W panels w/ SP interacted micro inverters, 10.25KW system, $3.94/W
28x LG NeonR 395W panels / SolarEdge SE10000H-US, 11.06KW system, $3.54/W

not sure if it's just me, but no luck of getting anywhere under $3.5/W with top name brands SunPower, Panasonic, LG, 30% lower would be $2.48/W for LG, or $2.76/W for SunPower.., anybody could get this price in NCal bay area please do let me know!

I plan to try if I can bargain on LG...but great suggestion on PVWatts, will definitely check that out! Thanks!

[PugPower]

I agree with JPM. Based on my research and experience (in S. Cali anyway) those quotes are at least 30% too high even for name brand panels. Maybe there is a price increase in materials that I am not aware of or maybe labor costs have increased. IMO it's just too much. Also from my experience installers generally under estimate the projected production so they can be sure to hit their guarantees. You should use PVWatts for a more accurate representation of your expected production.

[Ampster]

One big factor in making my panel decision was warranty. It's not just the amount of years but which company will still be around after that many years.

Yes that is important. My first panels in 2008 were BP Solar. Four years later they honored a warranty claim for all the panels. There was a recall based on bad solder connections.

[robbyg]

One big factor in making my panel decision was warranty. It's not just the amount of years but which company will still be around after that many years.

[InmarketforPV]

I have Sunpower, Canadian Solar, Hanwha Qcells and some rebranded cells on different buildings. I agree with solarix to just get tier 1 panels. I am putting panels on a new building and the guy helping me has a supplier with good prices on Mission Solar panels so I may go with those. The important thing to me is the quality of the install.

I did have another quote with mission solar panels, 30x325W panels for a 9.75KW system with Enphase IQ7plus-72x micro inverters. estimated annual production 14250KWh, faster degradation to 85% year 25, priced at $2.8/W.
It is a big price difference compared to LG quote, at $3.54/W: 28x395W LG NeonR LG395Q1C-A6 for a 11.06KW system, with SolarEdge SE10000H-US single inverter w/ optimizer, estimated annual production 15637KWh, slower degradation ~92.5% at year 25.

However, things I don't like about mission solar are: occupying pretty much all roof space with 30 panels but yet less powerful system (not covering 100%), limited to future upgrade if needed (needs to reserve some space for thermal solar pool heating), micro inverters being less efficient than SolarEdge, and of course faster degradation. Both are from local companies, with the LG one being more prestigious with top reviews and longer in business, their commitment to reimbursing system down cost is also a plus. Trying to see if any luck getting LG quotes from other locals ...

[Ampster]

I have Sunpower, Canadian Solar, Hanwha Qcells and some rebranded cells on different buildings. I agree with solarix to just get tier 1 panels. I am putting panels on a new building and the guy helping me has a supplier with good prices on Mission Solar panels so I may go with those. The important thing to me is the quality of the install.

[solarix]

LG and Sunpower are just about the most expensive options there are. Just look on Solarreviews.com for a reputable local installer and get a "most cost effective" quote using mainstream Tier ! panels and you'll be good. PV panels are all very durable, you don't need to pay extra for "quality" panels. There are three important criteria on choosing an inverter though:
1) reliability 2) reliability 3) reliability. Don't get a brand that has any plastic in the case, is made in China, mounts under the solar array, or doesn't have built in internet connectivity.

[oregon_phil]

foo1bar is exactly right. My install was from a smaller company that ordered my components after I signed the contract (terms pending AHJ approval) and the AHJ signed off on project. My project was 1 pallet plus 4 panels. They made sure the +4 panels were close enough in date code and other characteristics. You don't want the four extra stragglers to be to oddballs they found laying around in the warehouse. I know I have read posts in this forum where somebody has said "these three panels look different than the others, is this right?"

[foo1bar]

Let me ask around if the other local companies carry LG or SP.

I think that none of the smaller guys carry LG or SP or anything else.
I expect they get the panels from someone like Soligent - probably ordering a week or two worth of installs at a time, after they have a signed contract. They don't want to wind up having 5 modules left over that they can't get more matching ones to use on an install.

[J.P.M.]

All great suggestions, thanks foo1bar! Let me ask around if the other local companies carry LG or SP.

I'd also add downloading a slightly dated but free PDV of "Solar Power Your Home for Dummies" or spring the ~ $25 for an updated version at Amazon or bookstores. You need an unbiased education.

Also, know that most all decent quality PV panels in the same orientation and location will all produce about the same annual # of kWh per installed STC kW of PV. Spend more time evaluating vendors than worrying about or having bragging rights on overpriced and overhyped panels. You're still 20% or 30%$ overpriced, bay area or not.

Lastly, and to reiterate, know that net metering in CA will most likely be changing in the reasonably near future, making your payback times a lot longer. Believe it.

[oregon_phil]

I assume the LG 395's are LG 395 Neon R, N type 60 cell panels not the Neon 2 72 cell panels. I have 28 LG 365 Neon R for 10.22 kW going into an SMA 7.7 string inverter. I am happy with the LG and SMA string inverter combination. I have seen some forum posts regarding Neon 2 panel interconnect issues, but the Neon R is a different animal.

You didn't mention anything about shading. Long story short, I have minor winter shading issues. But knowing how my shade progresses across my pole barn roof, with today's solar panel technology, I would probably pick half cut cells so shade only affects 1/6 of the panel and stick with a string inverter using Tigo optimizers (optimizers aren't that much more expensive than rapid shutdown only modules).

As foo1bar mentioned, Sunpower monitoring using PVS6 doesn't let you monitor per panel production even though you have microinverters. There are several blogs, websites, etc. for people trying to access the PVS6 using a raspberry Pi or similar device. In other words, a work around. That seems like a lot of work and yet another system to learn and maintain.

More important to me is installer level access to my inverter so I can download data if I ever need to do troubleshooting. I have had to re-update my inverter firmware to get it to work properly. I couldn't do this if I had customer level access, but I am comfortable doing this because I am a retired technical nerd.

Companies will tell you that "we monitor your system so we can tell you when you have issues". That never happens so I monitor my system frequently.

[InmarketforPV]

All great suggestions, thanks foo1bar! Let me ask around if the other local companies carry LG or SP.

[foo1bar]

Thanks foo1bar, I agree both are quoted at high end. I do have quotes from local small companies using Tier2 panels like REC, Mission Solar, lower at $2.8~3/W, but decided to go with Tier1 panels, these are the only quotes I got so far offering SP and LG. So optimizer does have advantage of monitoring individual panel performance?

I would say it is a very slight advantage over not being able to monitor it. I think the benefit is more about showing off / novelty, not true utility. I was able to detect 1 module not hooked up in an array of 190, so it does have some utility, but that's a <1% benefit vs not having it.
Enphase microninverters (not sunpower) do have per-panel monitoring - so keep that in mind as well. (Personally I like Solaredge better than enphase - but I have very little concrete evidence to support my bias)

Since you're in PGE territory, make sure you are considering the time-of-use billing.
I know people who produce significantly less than the kwh that they consume - BUT because of time-of-use and how PGE does their net metering the peak period production offsets their off-peak consumption.

If you don't want what you consider Tier2, contact the companies you've talked to and tell them that you'd like to know if it would be more to go with a different manufacturer of panels. And give them a list of the ones you'd consider (ex. LG, Panasonic, SolarWorld, Canadian Solar, Trina, Qcells, etc.)

I'm not sure which ones you consider "tier 1" and which you don't, so you'll have to come up with the list.
Or tell the installer what your concerns are about the panels they put in the quote - ex. "I'm not comfortable with Mission Solar because I don't have confidence they'll be around in 5 years if I have a warranty issue. Is there another manufacturer you commonly use like LG or Panasonic or SolarWorld?"