Obama Administration Takes Action on Climate Change--Big Time

[russ]

Hogwash and mumbo jumbo. T

Chris - How can you say such horrible things about the Holy Church of Climate Change?

The proponents of this church refuse to accept anything except doctrine that has been approved by Reverend Al Bore.

[ChrisOlson]

Sorry, no, the MWP was not global in extent. Plus we know what likely caused that northern hemisphere warming: increased solar radiation and lower volcanic activity. Those influences are not in evidence today.

Hogwash and mumbo jumbo. There is no data that goes back much more than 100 years to prove anything of the sort. But it is perfectly obvious and historical fact that the Vikings sailed the Arctic Ocean with no ice on it for almost 1,000 years. So, when they try to claim that melting Arctic ice is caused by Global Warming (or Climate Change, or whatever they want to call it) today, they are full of chicken sheeite. The Arctic being warm and ice free on the ocean is not unprecedented. And the Vikings had very large farming communities in Greenland that is today under ice sheets and glaciers yet. So basically, if you have any common sense, things are getting back to normal that they were for at least 1,000 years before what they call "The Little Ice Age". And man has no control over it.

[Ian S]

Those records tell of a period of high global temperature that lasted approximately 1,000 years from around 300AD to about 1265AD.

Sorry, no, the MWP was not global in extent. Plus we know what likely caused that northern hemisphere warming: increased solar radiation and lower volcanic activity. Those influences are not in evidence today.

[ChrisOlson]

Actually, it's global warming causing climate instability and change. We're already seeing it. It will get worse. Get used to it. You're welcome.

My gosh, have you guys all been watching too much ALGOR TV, or what? While some emissions like particulates aren't good for people to breathe, CO2 is not a pollutant. It is part of the earth's natural carbon cycle.

None of this is about switching from coal to solar. It's all about money flowing from your pockets to a few who have invented the Climate Change Scam and the World Bank's CFU:

http://www.worldbank.org/en/topic/climatefinance

Whoever dreamed this up is brilliant - use FUD to sell it to the masses, then rake in the dough. The Carbon Market will be even bigger than the stock market - IF they can make their scam stick. And reading some of the responses here, it's pretty obvious that they already gotcha by the balls.

How about a history lesson?
What makes things like Climate Change possible is the masses' willingness to believe the sky is falling and that man actually has control over any of it. Even history as taught in our schools is warped to the Christian point of view, with Christopher Columbus "discovering" the Americas. Well, my wife and I are Scandinavian (wife native Swedish, me second generation Norwegian-American), and we're sailors, and we have great interest in Scandinavian history. The early Swedish, Danish and Norwegian Vikings were in North America long before Christopher Columbus was even born. The Vikings expansion from about 300AD to around 1600AD was VERY impressive. They were accomplished sailors and legend says they had navigation tools called Sunstones. The Sunstones were long thought by scientists to be a myth until one was discovered in an ancient shipwreck near the Channel Islands only two years ago:

http://www.livescience.com/27696-viking-sunstone-shipwreck.html

Yeah, scientists don't know everything.

The Vikings were feared all over Europe to the point where they even included a new litany in the early European Christian Church - "From the fury of the Northmen, O Lord deliver us". The Norse people were not "Christianized" until the late 17th century and the early Norse records were moved from Trondheim to Copenhagen in 1664, then subsequently burned to the ground by the Christians in 1728. However, they didn't get all of them. The records of early Viking settlements, explorations and trading that were stored in Nuuk, Greenland remained intact and were only discovered about 30 years ago.

Those records tell of a period of high global temperature that lasted approximately 1,000 years from around 300AD to about 1265AD. A period when the Arctic Ocean was totally ice free and Norse sailors sailed what is today called the Northwest Passage to Vineland (today called North America). And were as far west as Russia and the Bering Straits, sailing across the Arctic Ocean. The first mention of ice blocking the early Norse sailors' passage to Vineland is in 1262AD, as recorded in those archives. This period is called by historians the Medieval Warm Period. Modern Climate Change Scam Artists ignore it and even try to deny that it even existed:

https://sites.google.com/site/globalwarmingquestions/ar4mwp

And isn't it just amazing that we have Climate Finance and Carbon Trading Markets now? You're being hoodwinked, people. There is no government or politicians in history that have ever done ANYTHING for the "good" of humanity. It is all about money and nothing else.

[Ian S]

Global warming or is it Climate Change.

Actually, it's global warming causing climate instability and change. We're already seeing it. It will get worse. Get used to it. You're welcome.

[inetdog]

We can do our part to not over use or over pollute the Earth without all the hysteria.

I suppose we can, but the hysteria is a great motivator when you are under time pressure and 90+% of the world population is ignoring the problem.

[wanabefree]

More Green BS

Global warming or is it Climate Change. Next it will be the Arctic Freeze. More Green BS like a religious Cult. Part truth part fiction and mostly fear mongering.

We can do our part to not over use or over pollute the Earth without all the hysteria.

[pleppik]

I agree there will be jobs lost in the coal mining industry due to this EPA regulation.

The interesting thing is that there are now almost twice as many people in the U.S. who work in the solar industry as in coal mining. (Source: coal mining jobs, solar industry jobs)

I'm not sure why some people are so concerned about saving such a small number of jobs in a shrinking industry when there's potential to create so many new jobs in a growing industry. Maybe it's because coal mining jobs tend to be clustered in a small number of Republican-voting districts, where solar jobs tend to be spread out all over the place.

[Ian S]

Speaking of China...

A day after the USA announces the EPA regulation, we get this news:

China will set an absolute cap on its CO2 emissions from 2016, a senior government adviser said on Monday, a day after the United States announced new targets for its power sector, signalling a potential breakthrough in tough U.N. climate talks.

This is encouraging but I doubt it would have happened if the US had not made its own commitment. We are, after all, supposedly the world leader. I think future generations will thank us for leaving behind some significant stash of hydrocarbons for use not as fuels but as raw materials for plastics, pharmaceuticals, and other high value end products.

[Ward L]

Responding to Closed Thread on Same Topic

I agree there will be jobs lost in the coal mining industry due to this EPA regulation. And I agree we have China and India burning and planning to burn, a LOT OF COAL. Nether of these are justification for the USA to continue to pollute our climate with CO2. We have to do what is right, we are still the leader of the free world right? We also have to encourage other countries to do the right thing. We can't tell China to not burn our coal if we continue to burn coal too. All of the arguments are very similar to auto safety & smog problems in the 1960's and 70's, acid rain and the ozone layer in the 1980's. People claimed jobs would be lost and American lifestyle would decline with all of these new regulations. We lead the world and did most of the research for the world on these issues because we are the best position to do that. China has a ton of environmental regulations, but they are not enforced. If we don't act now, when will we? I would probably be against a new law if it put me out of a job, but in the big picture of things we can't make everyone happy all the time.....

[billvon]

Agreed. In terms of what this means for the solar industry I'd see:

- faster adoption of utility scale PV installations (to replace coal generation)

- retrofit of coal plants to add solar-thermal generation (already included in some natural gas plants)

In terms of the power industry overall I would expect to see:

- faster adoption of utility scale storage and smart grid load control/aggregation functionality

- more aggressive TOU pricing to compensate for loss of baseline generation

- real time pricing (a long sought after goal)

[Ian S]

Good to see that the adults are in charge now. Cleaning up your own mess is the responsible thing to do.

I couldn't agree more. Of course the earth has seen higher temperatures in the past but human civilization has not had to endure them and especially has not had to deal with the rate of temperature increase that we're seeing and that is probably baked into the climate pie at this point. Can we adapt? Probably but we're not even planning for that! BTW, a recent Cosmos laid out clearly and convincingly the case for anthropogenic global warming (AGW) and what it may mean. Worth watching.

[billvon]

Earlier this week, the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) proposed a new rule mandating that power plants cut their greenhouse gas emissions by 30% by 2030.

Good to see that the adults are in charge now. Cleaning up your own mess is the responsible thing to do.

[Sunking]

Biggest SCAM ever created. Any government who legislates CO2 emissions only has one purpose and one purpose only. That purpose is to get their hands into your pocket. If you believe otherwise you are a damn fool and deserve to be striped of your money and freedom. Climate change has been happening since the Big Bang and there is not a damn thing you can do about it except adapt to it. You cannot fight Mother Nature but you can fight your government with arms.

[Jason]

Earlier this week, the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) proposed a new rule mandating that power plants cut their greenhouse gas emissions by 30% by 2030. Some critics believe that the target is easily attained and does not go far enough, as a thirty percent cut will have little impact on global climate change given the growth of developing nations such as China and India. Others believe that the rule will have a devastating impact on US energy costs and competitive advantage. But the rule is not without its proponents, who hail the rule as at least a step in the right direction, and an affirmation of the United States' commitment to fighting climate change. The rule could even reduce energy costs in the long run as we switch to locally produced power, and renewable energy technologies such as solar panels.

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