Professional solar= financial scam almost every where USA vs regular utility rates.

[SunEagle]

Professionally installed solar is a financial loss almost every where in the USA, costing home owners MORE THAN $12K to $30K+ IN LOSSES, over just paying regular utility rates. Is the conclusion I have come to after training with and trying to get a job in solar sales for the last month. The website that spells this out most clearly is google project sunroof. Here is an example from my neighborhood:
Project Sunroof - Savings estimator (google.com)
8.5kw roof ONLY SAVES $5000 OVER 20 YEARS.
Cost of $3.44/kw BEFORE any rebates or tax credits $2.58 after tax credits.
3 local solar sales companies quoted me around $3/kw after tax credits.
And some rip off companies are charging $5 or more per watt.
They lie about yearly increases in estimated energy prices. They lie and say system will last 40 years to make the numbers look better. They lie and say ROI is 100% because you own it and the utility rate is 0% ROI because you never own it. The amount of number manipulations are not alwasy the salesmen's fault either, they are often trained that way and do not know better..

And the above example is based on buying the system 100% upfront and paying them to install it.
If one gets a 6% Home equity loan from a bank then the investment winds up being negative ROI.

Given that 90% of solar jobs are financed it has become aparent to me, almost all solar sales are scams. By scams I mean your investment typically takes 15 or more years to break even or you are at a negative rate of return with your money.

Are there any honest installers out there that can admit this? I've talked to 2 or 3 out of hundreds that are on the facebook forums peddling solar panels. It's really sad to see something I am passionate about turn out to be a scam industry.

Sure there are exceptions to this. Name states that have Good SCRECS or super high utility rates like CA, but even in those situations you can get over charged. There was a 10kw system sold in Massachusets and the sales guy posted the $40,000 check braging about it. Customer will break even after a few years, but still got over charged tens of thousands.

do your home work and install your own system is my advice.

Now tons of people have disagreed with me, but zero of them have showed me the financial numbers to prove their point. I've argued with solar sales guys saying solar is good in GA even though Georgia power is 6 cents!/kwh. People telling me $4/kwh can be profitable in NC. Or the crazy salesguy that gives $3000 "rebate" checks to his customers (kick back from inflated loan) and then shows a 26% fed tax credit on this loan advance. Shady stuff!

Actually I have been saying the same thing. For me if the final cost to install a 7kw system was around $2/watt it would still take me over 10 years to maybe get my money back. Most systems that I have gotten estimates on are more than $3/watt which puts the ROI way out there.

While I don't agree those installations are a scam I do think people need to do the math before they take the leap into solar.

[khanh dam]

sabersix you obviously sell solar. show me one place in the USA on google solar roofs project with a good value AND a local solar installer that comes in below that price. the combination is almost impossible to find. your petty name calling is sad.

[khanh dam]

Professionally installed solar is a financial loss almost every where in the USA, costing home owners MORE THAN $12K to $30K+ IN LOSSES, over just paying regular utility rates. Is the conclusion I have come to after training with and trying to get a job in solar sales for the last month. The website that spells this out most clearly is google project sunroof. Here is an example from my neighborhood:
Project Sunroof - Savings estimator (google.com)
8.5kw roof ONLY SAVES $5000 OVER 20 YEARS.
Cost of $3.44/kw BEFORE any rebates or tax credits $2.58 after tax credits.
3 local solar sales companies quoted me around $3/kw after tax credits.
And some rip off companies are charging $5 or more per watt.
They lie about yearly increases in estimated energy prices. They lie and say system will last 40 years to make the numbers look better. They lie and say ROI is 100% because you own it and the utility rate is 0% ROI because you never own it. The amount of number manipulations are not alwasy the salesmen's fault either, they are often trained that way and do not know better..

And the above example is based on buying the system 100% upfront and paying them to install it.
If one gets a 6% Home equity loan from a bank then the investment winds up being negative ROI.

Given that 90% of solar jobs are financed it has become aparent to me, almost all solar sales are scams. By scams I mean your investment typically takes 15 or more years to break even or you are at a negative rate of return with your money.

Are there any honest installers out there that can admit this? I've talked to 2 or 3 out of hundreds that are on the facebook forums peddling solar panels. It's really sad to see something I am passionate about turn out to be a scam industry.

Sure there are exceptions to this. Name states that have Good SCRECS or super high utility rates like CA, but even in those situations you can get over charged. There was a 10kw system sold in Massachusets and the sales guy posted the $40,000 check braging about it. Customer will break even after a few years, but still got over charged tens of thousands.

do your home work and install your own system is my advice.

Now tons of people have disagreed with me, but zero of them have showed me the financial numbers to prove their point. I've argued with solar sales guys saying solar is good in GA even though Georgia power is 6 cents!/kwh. People telling me $4/kwh can be profitable in NC. Or the crazy salesguy that gives $3000 "rebate" checks to his customers (kick back from inflated loan) and then shows a 26% fed tax credit on this loan advance. Shady stuff!