Solar pool heater under PV Solar Panels??

[MikeInRialto]

if PV panels generate heat - wouldn't solar pool heater panels help absorb the heat, thereby heating the pool & reducing heat under the PV panels?

*edit - what i left out/wasn't clear is that i meant to install the pool solar under the PV solar - so the pool solar wouldn't get sun, but it would get heat and remove heat from under the PV panels which are just inches above the pool solar.

[J.P.M.]

Dual use solar is a great idea that's been around for about as long as PV has been a commercial reality. Still a great idea, but not much more at this time - the devil is in the details. Still too many to be worked out before commercialization. A darling of the "you could just do this" crowd.

[MikeInRialto]

* please see edit in original post

[J.P.M.]

if PV panels generate heat - wouldn't solar pool heater panels help absorb the heat, thereby heating the pool & reducing heat under the PV panels?

*edit - what i left out/wasn't clear is that i meant to install the pool solar under the PV solar - so the pool solar wouldn't get sun, but it would get heat and remove heat from under the PV panels which are just inches above the pool solar.

That is not a good idea.

The pool water heating panels would not receive much, if any irradiance from the sun. They would receive some very small amount of energy via thermal radiation received from the backside of the panels, but that amount is so small it's probably not measureable, much less cost effective to go after.

Nice try however. Keep thinking.

[DanKegel]

See also

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photovoltaic_thermal_hybrid_solar_collector

There seems to be a couple vendors of hybrid pv/t panels, eg

http://sundrumsolar.com/

Sounds potentially messy, though.

[MikeInRialto]

INTERESTING!!!! I think i like the idea of it - especially since heating a pool via gas is very costly. I just might have to look into that down the line after i recover from $pending on the PV system.

Thanks for the link - could possibly be my 2016 or 2017 tax credit =)

[J.P.M.]

See also
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phot...olar_collector

There seems to be a couple vendors of hybrid pv/t panels, eg

http://sundrumsolar.com/

Sounds potentially messy, though.

While the vendor blurb is short on specifics and thus tends to make me skeptical, I'd have more immediate and real concerns about safety, as well as the lesser important but practical aspects such as a likelihood of voiding any PV warranty when the unavoidable problems appear.

I'd be very cautious and in no hurry to explore such schemes.

As for the link that describes the potential benefits: Fair enough, but the references at the end are examples of what I referred to in my 01/08/2016, 11:49 P.M. post. The idea has been around a long time.

One big challenge for this application is that an efficient method of heat transfer needs to be devised/used that is compatible with existing PV technology. Having spent a good portion of an engineering career in/around heat transfer, I'd suggest the idea is not ready for prime time just yet. Until it is, hang on to your money and wait for successful commercialization - which, IMO anyway, has a way to go.

[MikeInRialto]

; ) the hanging on to money is not a problem as it is going to take me awhile before i can really $pend - i was barely able to get the fund$ for the PV system together in time - thanks to a small interest free loan from a friend.

[J.P.M.]

; ) the hanging on to money is not a problem as it is going to take me awhile before i can really $pend - i was barely able to get the fund$ for the PV system together in time - thanks to a small interest free loan from a friend.

Yea, understood. A common situation.

[solarix]

The KISS principle applies to the dual-use solar panel idea. The affect on solar PV efficiency is not much for the additional cost and complexity of getting the thermal panels in contact with the back side - let alone violating the PV warranty. If not contacting the PV panel then the cooling effect is negligible. The pool heater will be drastically affected however by being in the shade of the PV panel. Cheaper, more reliable, more serviceable and a lot more effective to just mount the two systems separately.
What is with the suicidal drive for more efficiency? What is needed is better cost effectiveness (dollars/watt). Yes, efficiency is half that equation but creating a little efficiency at much higher cost is bad value.

[azdave]

Electricity and water back to back. What a great mix!

Besides, by the time my PV panels could really benefit from a cool drink my pool water is already too hot.

Phoenix, AZ

[DanKegel]

Let's not and say we did

[J.P.M.]

Electricity and water back to back. What a great mix!

Besides, by the time my PV panels could really benefit from a cool drink my pool water is already too hot.

Phoenix, AZ

An OK mix If done with simplicity in mind - but not simplemindedness. Think about (tank) storage type electric resistance water heaters. Or several hundred volt lines running over roofs subject to downpours or hosing/cleaning, etc.

Looking at this as a heat exchanger application - which it is - I'd take an educated guess and say one big challenge among several with this application would be to have a contact surface between the backside of the PV and the water containing portion of the assembly that will ensure good heat transfer. That's where a lot of the heat transfer products in use today are very deficient. Other important considerations are accessibility for cleaning/maint., and the big kicker - adequate design of the fluid containment that contacts the PV side as part of an adequate pressure boundary for the coolant while maintaining adequate thermal contact w/the PV side through any number and different types of thermal expansion. Adding to that is the fact that flat sided pressure vessels can be a particularly difficult application where cost, materials and weight are a priority as would be the case for this application. Material compatibility with the circulating fluid would also need consideration.

Folks I know in the heat exchanger business could probably do an adequate job of design. That an adequate design does not yet exist in a viable and marketable fashion tells me that while it may be possible, it's not yet marketable, probably and mostly because to do it safely and correctly means it isn't cost effective given the current market conditions.