Getting bids for system in the OC

[russ]

Its amazing hardware stores stay in business when only 1% of the population are capable of climbing a ladder and removing 5 bolts and 3 wire connections.

Get real - it is not that easy in most cases and 6" above the roof normally - the inverter being under the panel.

Besides, DIY stuff at home is like most people buying plants - the suppliers generally don't (didn't 40 years back) worry if the tree is the correct variety or not - virtually all die or the owner moves before the first flowers or fruit come.

[SunEagle]

Its amazing hardware stores stay in business when only 1% of the population are capable of climbing a ladder and removing 5 bolts and 3 wire connections.

True. But if those bolts and wires are under a 72 cell 4' x 6' panel in the middle of a solar array, it will require someone that will have to remove some large and heavy equipment using a ladder and not damage anything while doing so. Not something most home owners will want or even try to do.

If you have full access to the micro-inverter between each row of panels without having to remove good ones to get to the bad one then you will get more participation for DYI.

Dismantling the array to get to a bad device in the middle is not for the weak of mind or back.

[CraziFuzzy]

OK - You just placed yourself in the 1% but seem to want to speak for the 99%?

On the roof most anything under a panel probably won't be easy to work with.

Its amazing hardware stores stay in business when only 1% of the population are capable of climbing a ladder and removing 5 bolts and 3 wire connections.

[russ]

However, I was not trying to take this thread off course - I was just trying to counter the 'no-labor-warranty' comment that was made - not all feel replacing a microinverter to be a difficult item.

OK - You just placed yourself in the 1% but seem to want to speak for the 99%?

On the roof most anything under a panel probably won't be easy to work with.

[zhyue2003]

Just talked to my installer again about the SolarEdge warranty. He emailed me a document from SolarEdge about their reimbursement policy for licensed installers. It reads

"REIMBURSEMENT RATES
For each occurrence of a site visit resulting in equipment replacement under an
authorized RMA, SolarEdge will authorize payment of $50 per RMA (travel
reimbursement), plus $25 per item (equipment reimbursement) which is removed and
replaced. If the installation has a fully functioning internet connection and SolarEdge has
had the opportunity to diagnose and remedy the problem remotely, the travel
reimbursement increases to $100.

So basically my installer will get $100 for travel and $25 for replacing each item. So they won't charge me anything as long as this policy doesn't change later on or their labor suddenly become more expensive. BTW, I can't find this document on SolarEdge's website, so it must be between them and the installer only, aka not for DIY. He also mentioned that Enphase has a similar policy, which is why most of the installers told me they cover the replacement labor also.

Thanks very much for sharing. I will ask the installers I have been interacting with about this.

[thejq]

Just talked to my installer again about the SolarEdge warranty. He emailed me a document from SolarEdge about their reimbursement policy for licensed installers. It reads

"REIMBURSEMENT RATES
For each occurrence of a site visit resulting in equipment replacement under an
authorized RMA, SolarEdge will authorize payment of $50 per RMA (travel
reimbursement), plus $25 per item (equipment reimbursement) which is removed and
replaced. If the installation has a fully functioning internet connection and SolarEdge has
had the opportunity to diagnose and remedy the problem remotely, the travel
reimbursement increases to $100.

So basically my installer will get $100 for travel and $25 for replacing each item. So they won't charge me anything as long as this policy doesn't change later on or their labor suddenly become more expensive. BTW, I can't find this document on SolarEdge's website, so it must be between them and the installer only, aka not for DIY. He also mentioned that Enphase has a similar policy, which is why most of the installers told me they cover the replacement labor also.

[thejq]

The warranty aspect is not why I'm doing a DIY system (DIY installs in my area run less than half the cost of installed systems, with no draconian 'license-to-work-on-your-own-home-policies'). My only reason for bringing it up here is that the M250 gets great reviews, with the exception of the possibility of needing to pay labor for a warranty repair. That single negative is of no consequence to me. I enjoy working on my home, which makes my labor essentially free.

However, I was not trying to take this thread off course - I was just trying to counter the 'no-labor-warranty' comment that was made - not all feel replacing a microinverter to be a difficult item.

I think the M250 is a great choice, esp for DIY. You can install/test a few panels at a time and slowly grow the system. AC is also much safer to work with than DC.

[Enver Solar]

Too good to be true?

Works out to about $3.25 per kw. They originally came in closer to $4 per kw, but I knew their cost on another install, which was about 3.25, so I said I needed it to be close to $3 per kw.

The materials you listed are good and the micro converters will mean the system turns it's self on earlier and goes off later so that's a great plan. The price is great! A little too great. You need to ask a lot of questions about the install and other equipment they will be installing such as the racks, the Gauge of wiring being used, and especially the potential damage to your roof. At that price for that quality equipment, they have to be cutting corners somewhere. If that corner is in the install you could end up with leaking problems down the road. That could lead to mold. You really don't want that. ~Megan

[CraziFuzzy]

All installers would at least provide a 10-yr system warranty that includes everything. Some even longer. Nothing against DIY, if you have the know-how and proper license, go for it. Cost wise, unless you can buy it directly from distributors (like many of the large installers), you won't save much by buying from either wholesale online or retail outlets.

As for installers, I personally prefer a full electrical service company that does all type of jobs besides solar. There're just too many solar installers/integrators in the last 5-6 years because of the demand created by government subsidies. When the Fed incentives goes down from 30% to 10% in 2016, hopefully the price of solar will go down at least 20% to offset that. Otherwise it'd hard to say who will survive when the demand suddenly drops. My guess is that the full service outlets will probably be fine.

The warranty aspect is not why I'm doing a DIY system (DIY installs in my area run less than half the cost of installed systems, with no draconian 'license-to-work-on-your-own-home-policies'). My only reason for bringing it up here is that the M250 gets great reviews, with the exception of the possibility of needing to pay labor for a warranty repair. That single negative is of no consequence to me. I enjoy working on my home, which makes my labor essentially free.

However, I was not trying to take this thread off course - I was just trying to counter the 'no-labor-warranty' comment that was made - not all feel replacing a microinverter to be a difficult item.

[darkhelmet]

As for installers, I personally prefer a full electrical service company that does all type of jobs besides solar. There're just too many solar installers/integrators in the last 5-6 years because of the demand created by government subsidies. When the Fed incentives goes down from 30% to 10% in 2016, hopefully the price of solar will go down at least 20% to offset that. Otherwise it'd hard to say who will survive when the demand suddenly drops. My guess is that the full service outlets will probably be fine.

This is kind of my thinking too. The bid I'm currently considering is from an Electrical/HVAC/Solar company. It seems to me having multiple business lines helps insulate them from changes down the road in solar.

[thejq]

That seems to be the only negative I've seen written about the Enphase M250's, that the warranty period doesn't cover labor. Perhaps this is why I'm likely looking that way for my DiY project, where I'd be doing my own labor anyway.

All installers would at least provide a 10-yr system warranty that includes everything. Some even longer. Nothing against DIY, if you have the know-how and proper license, go for it. Cost wise, unless you can buy it directly from distributors (like many of the large installers), you won't save much by buying from either wholesale online or retail outlets.

As for installers, I personally prefer a full electrical service company that does all type of jobs besides solar. There're just too many solar installers/integrators in the last 5-6 years because of the demand created by government subsidies. When the Fed incentives goes down from 30% to 10% in 2016, hopefully the price of solar will go down at least 20% to offset that. Otherwise it'd hard to say who will survive when the demand suddenly drops. My guess is that the full service outlets will probably be fine.

[zhyue2003]

I think that becomes a grey area. For Enphase, I have been told by multiple installers that they will install it for free paid by Enphase. Some will actually put into writing. Since I'm not getting Enphase, I didn't dwell on it too much. But I remember reading the Enphase warranty that specifically said labor is not included. So go figure. For SolarEdge, the warranty states:
"Where SolarEdge decides to repair the Product or part(s), warranty coverage includes labor and material costs necessarily
incurred to correct the Product defect; and where SolarEdge decides to replace the Product or part(s) to which the
Limited Warranty applies, warranty coverage includes the cost of the replacement of the Product or part(s). "
So my installer said that means SolarEdge will pay him to replace the parts. Not sure if I can trust that, so I will try to get him to write it in the contract.

Is there a consensus on whether SolarEdge's warranty covers labor? Installers I have talked to seem to not think so. The language in the warranty as you posted above, "cost of the replacement of the Product or parts", seems fairly vague. The warranty also has the following language, which makes me wonder if labor is included at all.

All other costs, including, without limitation, travel and boarding costs of SolarEdge service personnel that are incurred for repairs of Products on-site, as well as costs related to buyer’s employees and contractors repair or replacement activities, are not covered by the Limited Warranty and, unless otherwise agreed in writing in advance by SolarEdge, shall be borne by the buyer.

[CraziFuzzy]

At present Enphase does not cover labor on new models according to numerous members.

That seems to be the only negative I've seen written about the Enphase M250's, that the warranty period doesn't cover labor. Perhaps this is why I'm likely looking that way for my DiY project, where I'd be doing my own labor anyway.

[russ]

At present Enphase does not cover labor on new models according to numerous members.

[thejq]

Would you please let me know where you have heard of the warranty of either Enphase or SolarEdgeon labor? I have told otherwise by installers. Thanks.

I think that becomes a grey area. For Enphase, I have been told by multiple installers that they will install it for free paid by Enphase. Some will actually put into writing. Since I'm not getting Enphase, I didn't dwell on it too much. But I remember reading the Enphase warranty that specifically said labor is not included. So go figure. For SolarEdge, the warranty states:
"Where SolarEdge decides to repair the Product or part(s), warranty coverage includes labor and material costs necessarily
incurred to correct the Product defect; and where SolarEdge decides to replace the Product or part(s) to which the
Limited Warranty applies, warranty coverage includes the cost of the replacement of the Product or part(s). "
So my installer said that means SolarEdge will pay him to replace the parts. Not sure if I can trust that, so I will try to get him to write it in the contract.