SolarEdge battery profile switching by owner (privileges)

[darkskies]

chronos432 I have a BUI on my setup and it measures both consumption and production. For everyone's consideration, from the Installation Guide for the BUI (my highlights added):

Backup Interface- controls disconnection of house loads from the grid and
integrates the following components to enable grid-tied solar backup and Smart
Energy Management. The Backup Interface must be installed to allow the operation
of batteries.

Energy Meter- is used by the inverter for export, import, production and
consumption readings, and for Smart Energy Management applications, such
as: export limitation, time-of-use profile programming and maximizing self-
consumption.

Auto-transformer- handles the phase load balancing.
200A microgrid interconnection device- disconnects the house loads from the
grid in case of a power outage.

Generator hardware support- supports connection for up to 15kW alternative
power supply. Generator connection requires supporting inverter firmware.

BTW: That last sentence has been the big grievance I've had with SE. They've been stating this since I bought the BUI in mid-2021, but that is a long and painful story.

[chronos432]

That is 100% the problem. The way MSC works is by having the CTs measure power back and forth from the grid. It makes instantaneous adjustments for inverter output to minimize import from the grid. Without a way to know how much power you are trying to pull from the grid, the inverter doesn’t know how much power to pull from the battery to meet your household loads. The only output option is to go max output which is 5kW.

Without the energy meter, you are configured as “Backup Power Only” instead of “Smart Energy Management”.

https://knowledge-center.solaredge.c...n_guide_na.pdf

soby the CTs are not necessary if you have a Backup Interface (BUI) with a service line intercept right? If everything is passing through the BUI first where service enters home before the main panel the BUI should be able to measure all loads and production without extra CTs it seems.

But that all makes sense if there is no BUI, no CTs and the main panel is directly connected to the grid, no way for the inverter to know what the house load is.

darkskies - do you have a BUI on your system or CTs?

toofargone - I assume you have no BUI.. there are flexible Rogowski type loops that they should have been able to use in case of fitment issues.

[Srrndhound]

This is the first time I have definitive evidence that my battery is NOT discharging properly under the "Maximize Self-Consumption" profile setting. For me, the battery just dumps the power at inverter max all at once until it hits reserve. It doesn't power the house through the evening >

I'm just curious about your production graph. It looks like your panels do not see the sun until ~11am. Am I reading that right? Is there an obstruction blocking your panels from the morning sun?

[soby]

Both my installer and a SolarEdge tech insisted that the lack of CTs shouldn't matter. But I suspect that might be my issue.

That is 100% the problem. The way MSC works is by having the CTs measure power back and forth from the grid. It makes instantaneous adjustments for inverter output to minimize import from the grid. Without a way to know how much power you are trying to pull from the grid, the inverter doesn’t know how much power to pull from the battery to meet your household loads. The only output option is to go max output which is 5kW.

Without the energy meter, you are configured as “Backup Power Only” instead of “Smart Energy Management”.

https://knowledge-center.solaredge.c...n_guide_na.pdf

[toofargone]

Is it going back into the grid? Power has to be going somewhere and not just being dissipated as heat…
or your house is more power hungry than you realize? Assume not the latter.

Yep, it goes to the grid (and powers the house, but only for the short time as it overflows to the grid). My utility company (PGE) provides graphs that shows the spike.

soby

darkskies The installer could not install consumption meters (CTs) due to fitment issues, so I don't really have consumption numbers/graphs to display. Instead, I purchased an Emporia meter--we use ~0.5 kWh in the evenings (after solar production fades out) dropping to .3 over night. During a recent power outage, the battery powered the house through the evening and overnight and was about 55-60% in the am.

Both my installer and a SolarEdge tech insisted that the lack of CTs shouldn't matter. But I suspect that might be my issue.

[darkskies]

darkskies does your HT system sound better on battery power? Any discernible difference image quality?

I see you’re in NH. I’m close by in Maine! Which installer did you go with?

I've not discerned an audio or video difference when on LG Battery as a power source vs grid, but I have a WattBox battery and line conditioner setup for the HT, so power is always clean.

RE Installer: Not sure if the forum has any policy about discussing companies, and I couldn't figure out how to private message - moderators can slap my hand, if I'm not allowed...

A small company from the seacoast called Harmony Energy Works. I've got mixed feelings on them. They use quality products for the install (on both my previous house and this house), had excellent workmanship, and pricing was reasonable. However, in the past few years, with a tough time getting workers, and the huge demand due to rate increases in this area (we are over $0.30 kwh), their customer service has been really lacking. It takes forever to get a hold of them, and to get them to follow up and resolve issues. That coupled with Solar Edge's Backup Interface quagmire (a long story, but they're selling a product that isn't fully operational, and hasn't been for 1.5 years so far), has reflected poorly on the overall experience.

I have to admit, the installer has been trying to make things better, by installing an automatic transfer switch to give some functionality, and are scheduling an upgrade of the inverter for the cost difference between the units, to boost production, which is less than what PV Watts was estimating on the original install.

[soby]

soby Yours isn't set to MSC right (maximize self consumption)? If I understand MSC correctly it should NOT be exporting to the grid from the battery. We have no TOU rates in Maine and it's net metering so I would never want to export to grid from the battery...

Thanks!

Correct. This is not normal behavior to output at full inverter capacity. But for a few dozen days in the summer, National Grid pays me an incentive to give them control of my setup to help them meet peak demand.

We also have 1:1 net metering with no TOU rates so I only charge the battery when there's clipping. Throughout the day, my inverter has a custom storage profile to only charge from clipped solar and then switches to MSC from 1am to 6am to drop the battery percentage back down to Backup Reserve.
Profile.JPG

[chronos432]

darkskies does your HT system sound better on battery power? Any discernible difference image quality?

I see you’re in NH. I’m close by in Maine! Which installer did you go with?

[darkskies]

It would be good to see your consumption toofargone . For me, my consumption in the evening is around 0.75-1.25kWh typically (except when running my home theater, then it is up to 2.5kwH for a few hours ). With my 16 kwh LG, I have about 12.8kwh, so I see it lasting anywhere from 10pm to 4-6am the next morning. Now granted, we're having lots of sun right now, so great generation, and low load (as heat is off). Battery gives great output:

IMG_2052.PNG

However, back in January, I only had the battery set to deplete down to 80% capacity, and would see it drop right down, due to the load. So, it would be good to see how much you are consuming to see if actually consuming or if it is being fed to grid.

[chronos432]

Depending on your afternoon consumption, that may not be incorrect. Can you post consumption chart too? This is what my chart looks like on a day with utility demand response when the battery dumps power to the grid starting at 4pm until I hit the battery minimum (~15%).

78998CE7-F3FF-41E4-A3DB-DD5B81A4FAF5.png

soby Yours isn't set to MSC right (maximize self consumption)? If I understand MSC correctly it should NOT be exporting to the grid from the battery. We have no TOU rates in Maine and it's net metering so I would never want to export to grid from the battery...

Thanks!

[soby]

Thanks for posting the screenshot, darkskies. This is the first time I have definitive evidence that my battery is NOT discharging properly under the "Maximize Self-Consumption" profile setting. For me, the battery just dumps the power at inverter max all at once until it hits reserve. It doesn't power the house through the evening >.<

Depending on your afternoon consumption, that may not be incorrect. Can you post consumption chart too? This is what my chart looks like on a day with utility demand response when the battery dumps power to the grid starting at 4pm until I hit the battery minimum (~15%).

78998CE7-F3FF-41E4-A3DB-DD5B81A4FAF5.png

[chronos432]

Thanks for posting the screenshot, darkskies. This is the first time I have definitive evidence that my battery is NOT discharging properly under the "Maximize Self-Consumption" profile setting. For me, the battery just dumps the power at inverter max all at once until it hits reserve. It doesn't power the house through the evening >.<

IMG_0268.jpg

Is it going back into the grid? Power has to be going somewhere and not just being dissipated as heat…
or your house is more power hungry than you realize? Assume not the latter.

[toofargone]

Hopefully, my diagram above answers your question (if not, please rephrase). With mine, with max self-consumption, it prioritizes using the battery, and re-charging the battery, over sending to grid.

HTHs

Thanks for posting the screenshot, darkskies. This is the first time I have definitive evidence that my battery is NOT discharging properly under the "Maximize Self-Consumption" profile setting. For me, the battery just dumps the power at inverter max all at once until it hits reserve. It doesn't power the house through the evening >.<

IMG_0268.jpg

[Srrndhound]

Yeah, my stereo system eats too much power to be on a UPS.

Usually power amps are not essential to be on UPS unless the goal is to have uninterrupted playback during a power disruption. Most important for UPS are things with computer chips, spinning drives (optical or HDD), and lamp-based video projectors. Get enough UPS to allow controlled shut down / cooling and the gear is protected.

I have a whole house surge protector installed, this is NOT due to concern for power surges, solely audio quality due to increased "power quality".

A surge protector's only quality improvement is in the form of limiting extreme grid voltages that exceed the device's clamping limit. That might save a component's life, but it will otherwise do nothing for sound quality.

[darkskies]

I use a WattBox with UPS, surge, and line conditioning for all my sensitive electronics (not the amps, though, which just have surge protection).