sunny boy inverter?

[RottenMutt]

i would only use the secure power socket to charge a battery and a AC inverter to power you refrigerator.
or to charge a car..

[solardreamer]

I will take that as a NO. You have not demonstrated or proven that you have AC coupled a GT inverter with a non UL off grid inverter. I did not ask for a history of all the different inverters that you have "used with" other inverters. A simple example of any GT inverter AC coupled to a non UL inverter would suffice. A true AC coupled demonstration would include operations through several days with varying loads so the control of the GT inverter by the non UL inverter would demonstate that AC coupling actually happened and both inverters performed as a system. As I suspected, we probably have different definitions of what the term "AC coupled" actually means. We are back to the beginning of this conversation where the term "fake", hijacked this thread. My apologies to the OP.

Once again you jumped to the wrong conclusion.

[Ampster]

For UL GTI I have successfully used with several different non-UL off grid inverters......

I will take that as a NO. You have not demonstrated or proven that you have AC coupled a GT inverter with a non UL off grid inverter. I did not ask for a history of all the different inverters that you have "used with" other inverters. A simple example of any GT inverter AC coupled to a non UL inverter would suffice.
A true AC coupled demonstration would include operations through several days with varying loads so the control of the GT inverter by the non UL inverter would demonstate that AC coupling actually happened and both inverters performed as a system. As I suspected, we probably have different definitions of what the term "AC coupled" actually means. The uninformed will not be further informed by the information provided. The informed will be unimpressed by the attempt to call any thing described above as AC coupled.

We are back to the beginning of this conversation where the term "fake", hijacked this thread. My apologies to the OP.

[mudhole]

The SPS (secure power system) must be manually (re)activated at the inverter either when the Grid fails, or shutdown from inadequate solar

the literature on the sps is really lacking, basically what i did was wire per their diagram, i am not sure where you would manually switch it back on, unless you are talking external to the inverter, just the switch i wired per the diagram.

[solardreamer]

I misinterpreted your statement when you said, "Not all GTI enforce UL GTI specs so it depends on the GTI."
Have you actually AC coupled a GT inverter to to a non UL inverter off grid or are you speculating on the possibility? If so what make and model? What profile did you use?

For UL GTI I have successfully used with several different non-UL off grid inverters. The split-phase low frequency inverters are more convenient and a bit robust to work with. As example, AIMS and SunGoldPower both sell inverters with similar specs to the 4KW low frequency inverter I used. I actually didn't end up having to change the GTI profile to get it to work as decent non-UL inverters provided surprisingly good quality power (power, frequency, power factor, thd, protection, etc.). It's really not difficult to find inverters that would work with UL GTI. The much more challenging part is managing and maintaining the interaction between them as I believe you are aware of. Again none of this is for uninformed readers.

[Ampster]

The SPS (secure power system) must be manually (re)activated at the inverter either when the Grid fails, or shutdown from inadequate solar

That should be easy enough to do. It is also a simpler and safer solution than the yet to be documented scheme offered by Solardreamer. I have asked him several times for details and none have been provided. AC coupling is not a trivial exercise but it can be done with the right equipment.

[Mike90250]

The SPS (secure power system) must be manually (re)activated at the inverter either when the Grid fails, or shutdown from inadequate solar

[Ampster]

..LOL I basically wanted it to keep a chest freezer frozen...I guess i could just sit next to it and cut it on and off as clouds pass, LOL...

If you don't access the chest freezer much the intermittent power of passing clouds should not be a problem. After the clouds pass I do not know if that outlet on the inverter needs to be reset. I have a vague memory of something like that but it may have had to do with resetting the inverter when power comes back. Perhaps someone who knows can clarify.

[oregon_phil]

SMA has been all over the map on rapid shutdown and Tigo devices. The older SMA 2014 RSD box allowed secure power to be used, but not a good device if you really wanted 3 MPPT.

SMA inverters with Secure power with TIGO devices was going to work in SMA literature right before the -41 upgrade. But now, secure power is available on -41 inverters but not with SunSpec rapid shutdown devices. They have pulled all their literature claiming secure power will work with rapid shutdown and/or optimizer devices. I know secure power works with -40 inverters work with TIGO TS4-R-O optimizers, but I don't find it very useful because, so far, my catastrophes happen when the sun isn't shining.

I have re-read this entire thread and I can't figure out whether or not the OP used rapid shutdown devices in the design.

[khanh dam]

that is great to know, i wondered how they would buffer for clouds etc...if i would have really thought about this i should have deduced that as well...so i would go DC, to AC (secure outlet), back to dc, then to AC...LOL I basically wanted it to keep a chest freezer frozen...I guess i could just sit next to it and cut it on and off as clouds pass, LOL...

the RSD modules that allow secure power from sma inverters are said to be no longer made. Tigo said their current RSD MIGHT WORK, but they will not test it for you. best bet is to install a carport or pergola that does not require RDS devices if you really really want this feature, otherwise you are out of luck.

[mudhole]

But the power the SMA secure outlet provides is not consistent based on the varying sunlight and therefore should be used only to charge a battery or run a non critical load.

Oh and is UL compliant and legal to use in the USA.

that is great to know, i wondered how they would buffer for clouds etc...if i would have really thought about this i should have deduced that as well...so i would go DC, to AC (secure outlet), back to dc, then to AC...LOL I basically wanted it to keep a chest freezer frozen...I guess i could just sit next to it and cut it on and off as clouds pass, LOL...

[Ampster]

... The discussion is about using GTI when not connected to utility grid. My comment about some UL GTI is to indicate the possibility to potentially set different profile when using the GTI while not connected to the utility grid.

I misinterpreted your statement when you said, "Not all GTI enforce UL GTI specs so it depends on the GTI."
Have you actually AC coupled a GT inverter to to a non UL inverter off grid or are you speculating on the possibility? If so what make and model? What profile did you use?

[solardreamer]

You are evading the question. Setting the profile on an inverter is not the same as installing an inverter that does not meet code. You are trying to suggest that there is a utility that will allow someone to install a GT inverter that backfeeds the grid and which is not UL compliant. I agree with @SunEagle that there is not such a utility in the USA.

Not sure what you are talking about. I am certainly not suggesting there is an utility in the US that would allow connecting non-UL GTI to their grid. The discussion is about using GTI when not connected to utility grid. My comment about some UL GTI is to indicate the possibility to potentially set different profile when using the GTI while not connected to the utility grid.

[Ampster]

Even with UL certified GTI, some will let you set profiles to operate differently.

You are evading the question. Setting the profile on an inverter is not the same as installing an inverter that does not meet code. You are trying to suggest that there is a utility that will allow someone to install a GT inverter that backfeeds the grid and which is not UL compliant. I agree with @SunEagle that there is not such a utility in the USA.

[solardreamer]

Actually you are making an incorrect statement and may have an illegal system if you live in the USA. To be legal in the USA your solar equipment must carry a UL certification or the POCO & AHJ will not approve it. Sure if you live up in the wilderness and the nearest town is miles away you can try to get away with anything you want but it may not be safe or legal should you try to sell the place.

Exactly. It all depends on various factors. Even with UL certified GTI, some will let you set profiles to operate differently.