Buying House With Solar Installed

[J.P.M.]

The guy you were replying to seemed to be talking about actual value of solar, and you were talking about something much bigger and more general; I wasn't sure he noticed, so I tried to clarify.

Give it a rest Dan. Crawl back in your hole.

But, before that, take a lesson and know that some of us have the common sense to know that what we write is usually read by more folks than just the one being responded. I suspect most of us are aware of a more general broadcast.

Besides, where do you come off being so arrogant that you assume people are so mentally slow that they don't understand what's written by others and need your salient insights to make the world clear to them ? Or, that they may care what I, or anyone for that matter anyone, may write in the first place ?

What smug hubris.

[J.P.M.]

If you are covering 95+% of you electric bill, and can prove it, nobody can say it has no value.

Proof is a slippery concept. In a simple sense, if a system's current annual savings can be documented and it's added value can be ascertained from that, then some value can be ascribed.

But that takes no account of the cost of maint. and a value to the risk that the system will cause more problems that may be more costly than the savings, or that future value on a resale may be negatively impacted by a system's presence. I can think of several scenarios where someone might be of the opinion that an existing PV system has no added value, or even negative value. One of several might be:

Aesthetics and potential problems over time from poor installation. There are a fair amount of derelict solar water heater in my HOA. They look abandoned. Owners usually are clueless if the systems are even working, or actually, believe it or not, wasting more energy than they might produce. Hard to say in a quantitative sense what that does to a home's marketability. Neighbors seem to think it detracts from the value of the neighborhood and hence their home's, value. To my observation, folks often and usually tend to be funny about stuff like that.

Now, think 5 -10 tears down the road, and think about a PV system that's 10 years old, covers 4-6 times or more of the area of a water heater, with a bunch of roof penetrations and all installed by Larry with a ladder, or perhaps worse, the homeowner, for lowest initial cost and no roof maintenance done at install. Besides what it may look like, what would a reasonable person think ? Is the lower bill worth the (probably incompletely) known risk ? Oh, and production has rolled off from normal aging and (also) the array has not being maintained any better than the water heater situation described.

Thinking that today's system will add value to a home in the future simply because it produces savings off a bill, and solar is today's media and peddler produced darling, and is looking and performing like new seems shortsighted to me.

Unless you are the homeowner and know what you're buying, any current PV system is a pig in a poke. I suppose the same can be said about every home's mechanical add ons and equipment like appliances, plumbing and such, but PV usually costs a lot more, and, being on a roof, can lead to more problems than say, for example, if a garage door opener goes south. Even if knowledgeable, a potential buyer does not know if an existing system was properly and professionally installed such that it will off set any potential price premium - that is , produce annual savings as claimed, and do so for a period long enough to equal or exceed the asking premium, which is a real sketchy number anyway. Additionally, will it do so while not causing maintenance or worse problems.

A couple of reasons why I'd not buy a home with an existing PV system, and, separately why, in IMO only, PV, as a general housing market feature only adds value to a property to the extent of buyer's ignorance and the seller's or seller's agent's ability to hype a product.

[peakbagger]

The big difference between an old Hot Water system and an old PV system is an old hot water system usually leaks down and is pretty well inert. A PV system on the other hand could have 500 volts DC looking to go to ground. I have been asked to look at orphaned systems over the years and I usually decline. Inevitably the new owners have called multiple electricians and no one would go near an orphaned system. it all comes down to they don't think the risk is worth the reward for working on it. Usually they get some "solar specialist" who convinces them to rip down what's there and put in new.

I expect that in the long term there is going to be an service issue with all these solar systems installed by the lowest bidder and I really am not sure if there is much or repair infrastructure out there. Add in the rapid change in technology and expect there will be many orphaned systems. I have a "state of the art" (when it was installed) grid tied array in operation, it consists of four 160 watt panels, two pairs of series wired panels connected in parallel to a 1 KW grid tied inverter. When it dies, whose going to have clue how to fix it? Even if they had a clue, where would they get an inverter? I expect I will just rewire the panels in series and see if I can get a microinverter to work.but expect most pros will offer to remove them for a price.

[J.P.M.]

The big difference between an old Hot Water system and an old PV system is an old hot water system usually leaks down and is pretty well inert. A PV system on the other hand could have 500 volts DC looking to go to ground. I have been asked to look at orphaned systems over the years and I usually decline. Inevitably the new owners have called multiple electricians and no one would go near an orphaned system. it all comes down to they don't think the risk is worth the reward for working on it. Usually they get some "solar specialist" who convinces them to rip down what's there and put in new.

I expect that in the long term there is going to be an service issue with all these solar systems installed by the lowest bidder and I really am not sure if there is much or repair infrastructure out there. Add in the rapid change in technology and expect there will be many orphaned systems. I have a "state of the art" (when it was installed) grid tied array in operation, it consists of four 160 watt panels, two pairs of series wired panels connected in parallel to a 1 KW grid tied inverter. When it dies, whose going to have clue how to fix it? Even if they had a clue, where would they get an inverter? I expect I will just rewire the panels in series and see if I can get a microinverter to work.but expect most pros will offer to remove them for a price.

Thank you.

Seems to me that your comments about serviceability or what sounds like the current lack of it for orphaned systems would add to much weight to the argument that an existing PV system adds to the value of a property.

Tear it off and do it again doesn't sound either pleasant or cost effective for a potential buyer.

As for a business opp. for array repair: Maybe similar to TV repair or other electronic devices - mostly non existent except what amounts to scrap and replace w/new.

I would comment, however, that your post offers something for those looking to install PV at their residence to consider in that there is a sometimes/perhaps an unmentioned and perhaps unconsidered advantage of using quality, established electrical contractors: They were around before PV, and because that's not their only source of income, the probability may be higher that they'll be around after solar peaks to service their customers, or at least higher than that of the big national bottom feeding outfits or the local in/out losers being around to service their customers.

[desant89]

So basically the general consensus is that if you do not plan on staying in your home for a long time, or at least long enough to get all of your money back from the PV system, don't bother to get it. Just saying cause I am about to go solar, and I am not sure how long I will stay here given these NJ property taxes. I think a fair guess would be at least 5 years. Sure can be 20+ for all I know, but nobody ever knows.

[J.P.M.]

So basically the general consensus is that if you do not plan on staying in your home for a long time, or at least long enough to get all of your money back from the PV system, don't bother to get it. Just saying cause I am about to go solar, and I am not sure how long I will stay here given these NJ property taxes. I think a fair guess would be at least 5 years. Sure can be 20+ for all I know, but nobody ever knows.

Far from a general consensus. Opinions in the other direction are probably just as prevalent although I believe generally less than well informed. Depending on how you run the numbers and what your choices are, not bothering w/ PV is one possibility that may be among the cost effective options. If the goal is the lowest long term way to provide electricity to a dwelling, PV is generally not part of the least expensive mix of options, but that varies a fair amount. Expensive POCO power, guaranteed low maint., SRECS and a low LCOE for solar (which, if folks are informed and are truly honest and realistic about assumptions, usually requires a longer lifecycle time than most folks may own a PV system) relative to POCO power costs might be seen as advantages to solar. You gotta run the numbers. Every situation and lifestyle choice is different. Unfortunately, ignorance seems abundant.

[Mike90250]

Selling a home with solar panels revolves around the homeowner, being able to explain the advantages to the Realtor, who explains it to the prospective Buyer. Like when swimming pools were only for rich people. The heating, cleaning, chemicals, insurance,,,,

[azdave]

Well, if I have to be honest, it sounds like a great deal...

Well, the OP hasn't been active here in over three years so he probably won't be getting back to you on that but who knows?