solar panels already for retail sale at under a dollar

[muskrat]

I keep reading how this or that company can now produce a solar panel for under a dollar a watt but you can't actually buy them.Sunelec.com is selling $1.20 a watt panels right now.If you buy the rest of the system from them they will sell you the 60 watt kaneka panels for 98 cents per watt. This is the actual retail price not the production cost price.For a while they were selling whole crates of 25 panels at 98 cents per watt but got smart and now require you purchase other items to get this price.Their other products are fairly reasonable though so still not a bad idea. I get frustrated by people who say we will have panels this cheap in five or ten years when they can be purchased right now!

[Sunking]

Well I would not get too excited as of yet. The huge discounts are not because production cost have fallen off the cliff, it is the sales that has fallen off the cliff. Since Sunelec is a private company and I cannot see any performance metrics, I can use others and give an educated guess Sunelect is selling well below cost to try to keep the doors open for business.

[Xulander]

An article from two years ago,
[QUOTE]http://www.americanscientist.org/sci...shortage-eases

Brighter Future for Solar Panels: Silicon Shortage Eases

from the Christian Science Monitor

Quartz, the raw material for solar panels, is one of the most abundant minerals on earth. But for years, the solar industry has faced a bottleneck in processing quartz into polysilicon, a principal material used in most solar panels. The problem stalled a steady decline in prices for solar panels.

Now the silicon shortage may be coming to an end, predict some solar analysts, thanks to new factories coming online.

If true, the price for solar panel modules could start falling by as much as a third by 2010, says Travis Bradford, president of the Prometheus Institute for Sustainable Development in Cambridge, Mass. That

[russ]

@Xulander - The prices could fall to zero as well - if the world came to an end. Sure we will see grid parity - not for the next ten years for sure and probably a lot longer.

From your post If the manufacturers are hurting, its probably because of the political a$$holes in alternative energy forums chasing off prospective customers!

İf you spent a little time looking around and did a bit of research you might have an idea of what the realities are. With your present knowledge you are just parroting something you have seen elsewhere without understanding what it means.

The silicon is only one part of the overall system.

[Xulander]

From your post If the manufacturers are hurting, its probably because of the political a$$holes in alternative energy forums chasing off prospective customers!

Yes and if I had not typed the above line I have a feeling we would not have been graced by your highly informative reply! Fortunately I did not misspell one single word.
My degree is in business systems analysis, while I admit to not knowing everything about alternative energy, I have read a book or two, and by trait also have a low tolerance for ignorance.

Back to the topic?

Most everything I have read seems to match fairly well with the OP, If anyone would like to enlighten us by simply making a point, or posting a link to an article that states otherwise, then please do. I am here to learn.

[russ]

First the insulting type and then the explanation [/I]I have read a book or two, and by trait also have a low tolerance for ignorance.[I]

İ am impressed!

No one should place anything on a platter for such a discerning and intelligent type. Like İ said before, plenty of information out there but it does take a little work - does that scare you off?

[Mike90250]

I keep reading how this or that company can now produce a solar panel for under a dollar a watt but you can't actually buy them.Sunelec.com is selling $1.20 a watt panels right now.If you buy the rest of the system from them they will sell you the 60 watt kaneka panels for 98 cents per watt. This is the actual retail price not the production cost price.For a while they were selling whole crates of 25 panels at 98 cents per watt but got smart and now require you purchase other items to get this price.Their other products are fairly reasonable though so still not a bad idea. I get frustrated by people who say we will have panels this cheap in five or ten years when they can be purchased right now!

I want my flying car!!

[russ]

Just happen to have one for sale - few very minor problems though.

1) one direction of travel only
2) only good for one trip (then it is good for recycling though)

[Xulander]

İ am impressed!

I am not surprised!

As I had mentioned in my initial post,

My local (Hydro-power) power company just bought a huge solar farm a month ago!

If we are paying the utility companies as much as .30 per KWH a few years from now wouldn't we then be approaching grid parity?

Russ, I agree that this is a very unproductive thread, I hope in the future you will find someone with whom you can have a meaningful discussion involving facts, without feeling threatened.
I now have another baseless argument under my belt, thank you for that.

Unsubscribing!

[russ]

The probable reason utilities are paying 30 cents per kWh is a state mandated percentage of green power they must utilize.

Now California is mandating energy storage. Energy storage is important and necessary for wind or solar to become an economical part of the mix. Many parties are working on it and the government is investing in research but it isn't here yet. Mandating something that will be super expensive does not seem like a smart way to go - it's not like the state has surplus funds to throw around.

İt is easier to have a meaningful discussion when one party does not start off with the statement, 'If the manufacturers are hurting, its probably because of the political a$$holes in alternative energy forums chasing off prospective customers!' The statement shows a definite political statement being made. Exactly what the poster is railing against.

The reason for progress renewable energy has made the past years is government investment along with trials of promising efforts. Most will fail, as with any new technology, and a few will succeed.

Mandating anything is a politicians method of making points with one group or the other and ensuring a steady stream of money down the toilet.

All potential sources of clean and cleaner energy need to be worked on. We (or our children) will need them in the future.

[muskrat]

loss leader yes but still available

Although sunelec is selling these kaneka panels at cost to drum up business they have assured me they are not selling them below cost at 98 cents a watt.
Neither is a onetime deal that will be going away anytime soon. Even at $1.20 a watt these panels can generate a very decent payback time as long as you can keep your balance of system cost low.It may be six months or a year before anyone matches their price but certainly not the 5 or ten years many bloggers seem to imply as a time frame for reaching grid parity.Nanosolar has been claiming to be coming out with a home system in 2010 on their homepage blog.They have repeatedly claimed the ability to manufacture panels for well under a dollar a watt.There will undoubtedly be a thinning of the solar herd as those company's who can sell systems that are competitive with line power ramp up production leaving their less efficient brethren in the dust.Now it's time to start working on the infrastructure of regulations and training that will be needed to make solar electric cost effective on an installed basis. Brackets inverters mounting systems and installation labor are now the major cost of solar. Good design and planning in new construction will be what sets the final payback time. This is such an exciting time!

[lile001]

This is such an exciting time!

You said it, wise Mr. Muskrat! Solar electric is just about to explode. Sunelec has sold shipment after shipment of these $0.98 per watt panels, I am pretty certain they are buying them by the shipping container load. All the other manufacturers know about this, and are also aware of the price point.

It'll take no more than a few shiny roofs full of solar panels in areas that had none a couple of years ago to see the trend snowballing.

[MarineLiner]

As I had mentioned in my initial post,
If we are paying the utility companies as much as .30 per KWH a few years from now wouldn't we then be approaching grid parity ?
I agree that this is a very unproductive thread, I hope in the future you will find someone with whom you can have a meaningful discussion involving facts, without feeling threatened.
I now have another baseless argument under my belt, thank you for that.
Unsubscribing!

Hold it, hold it. Not so fast.

[muskrat]

sorry to see the flame war!

I'm sorry this thread got into a bit of a name calling argument! The whole point is that grid parity at least in many areas is already here now if careful cost containment is used on mounting cabling ect.My friend has already received his equipment from solelec.com and despite a few small snafu's with connectors we will start mounting the panels this weekend for a 3200 watt system. Money is being saved by doing his own labor and building his own racks instead of buying commercial ones.This system should hit repayment in about 10 years without counting tax incentives and the local utility rebate system. Missouri has some of the cheapest power in the country so if is cost effective here it should be cost effective almost anywhere.It's no longer a matter of 5years or ten years down the road.At least for the do it your self-er the time is now.

[muskrat]

second company has now matched <dollar per watt

Doing a search on lowest price per watt solar now gives a second company with a $.98 per watt price on Kaneka solar panels with an order of 10 or more.Now what we need is cheap connecting cables!