Fridge / freezers

[SunEagle]

Preppers like the solar power because they believe that if something happens like the collapse of the dollar
you're not going to be able to get fuel of any kind for a while.

I live in the sticks and I like using solar power it's a great back up when the grid goes down
we lose electric on a regular basis here. I have a generator but that's a pain in the butt
I like this better No gas to buy, No cords to run, No going outside to try and start a generator at -0
"Just flip a switch" Oh Yea,, no bill comes in the mail

And when your batteries die and they are no longer being made due to a collapsed economy what are you going to do?

Batteries like fossil fuel have to be manufactured. If the collapse happens then we will all be living a life similar to the days of horse and buggy before the electric light bulb.

[Leehamrick]

Preppers like the solar power because they believe that if something happens like the collapse of the dollar
you're not going to be able to get fuel of any kind for a while.

I live in the sticks and I like using solar power it's a great back up when the grid goes down
we lose electric on a regular basis here. I have a generator but that's a pain in the butt
I like this better No gas to buy, No cords to run, No going outside to try and start a generator at -0
"Just flip a switch" Oh Yea,, no bill comes in the mail

[russ]

All of the LPG delivery problems vanish with solar powered refrigeration, or solar powered anything for that matter. Yes, the initial cost is high, but after that, no fuel costs, no fuel delivery problems, and much less energy consumption. A 12vdc compressor refrigerator uses one tenth the energy of an absorption (LPG) powered unit. If properly designed and maintained, the solar powered system requires no fuel or major expense for the life of the batteries, which can exceed 10 years. It is a perfect solution where fuel delivery can be difficult, such as long maritime voyages.

Please explain further - so far it sounds like 2$ worth of blather in a 1$ bag. It sounds like you are arguing for a battery based system?

[dieseldawg]

Solar needs no fuel, that's why

All of the LPG delivery problems vanish with solar powered refrigeration, or solar powered anything for that matter. Yes, the initial cost is high, but after that, no fuel costs, no fuel delivery problems, and much less energy consumption. A 12vdc compressor refrigerator uses one tenth the energy of an absorption (LPG) powered unit. If properly designed and maintained, the solar powered system requires no fuel or major expense for the life of the batteries, which can exceed 10 years. It is a perfect solution where fuel delivery can be difficult, such as long maritime voyages.

[dkpro1]

Enough is Enough, base price on a sunfrost fridge/ freezer 3000 dollars.
Last word on the subject from me.
Dave H.

enough for me Avanti 7.1 cf fridge 300.00
500 watts solar 375.00
800 watt inverter 100.00
2 t105's 250.00


and no 4.00 a gallon lp

[bonaire]

That means they are paying 10 to 20 more for electricity than they have to.

Not entirely. they crowd source things and do a lot of the work themselves. They also do good work. Think of a PV system installed without all the labor costs. So it's parts and time. Probably $2.50/Watt if solar before incentives (they're able to take the tax credit and other state-stuff too). A few Amish farms near me have small windmills, some have solar, and they utilize batteries for chilling milk before it is delivered to the milk trucks daily. Compared to the .167/kWh utility rate we have - not too bad. They also use propane for things like refrigeration and lighting in workshops.

I don't know why they don't want to be part of the "larger community" but perhaps they don't trust "us"? Given a war or some other outside Force Majeur, which could take their whole community off the grid, I guess they consider a farm as a working independent entity which should be self-sustaining based on the family unit.

The guys who built my shed were mainly Amish with Mennonite company owners. The top of their building was full of Solar PV - installed by who ended up being my installer, also Mennonite. I believe that my install helped him finish his at-home install at a decent rate since the modules that I ordered were part of an order that included modules and inverters for his new home. The Mennonite and Amish keep spectacularly nice-looking homes because they're not cluttered full of electric and other junk that we "English" use. If it wasn't for my family situation, I wouldn't mind living "like the Amish" for the most part. My mother was a bit of a hermit and hobby farmer herself and her monthly electric bill showed about 180kWh or less for a 2400 sq. ft. house.


THIS: http://news.yahoo.com/bulgaria-gover...073220738.html
is the type of reason the Amish want to stay off grid and away from the national government.

[Naptown]

That means they are paying 10 to 20 more for electricity than they have to.

But think of what they are saving in gasoline! Their vehicles are only 1 HP.

Actually in some of the shops (woodworking) the saws and tools are run from compressed air driven by a big diesel compressor.

[Sunking]

As I understand it, the problem is being tied to the grid. Something about being dependent. My step-son worked on an Amish farm for awhile and they were all about battery banks, PV panels, and generators.

That means they are paying 10 to 20 more for electricity than they have to.

[Holtdoa]

Actually Quakers have not problem with electricity.
The Amish who are the primary users of gas refrigeration and make a good one don't like electricity.
Strange quirk of this religion is that they are allowed to have telephones computers and power tools for use in their business but not in their homes.

As I understand it, the problem is being tied to the grid. Something about being dependent. My step-son worked on an Amish farm for awhile and they were all about battery banks, PV panels, and generators.

[Mike90250]

Wow, we're paying closer to $4/gal for LPG here.


So, several places on the net I've seen the statement that new, high-efficiency 120V fridges are so efficient now that they're about the same energy usage (via an inverter) as just buying a specialty 24V DC fridge. Is there any truth to this? On the one hand, I'd expect specialty built off-grid fridges to be the most efficient thing out there. On the other hand, energy usage is something appliances now compete on in big box stores, and that usually drives innovation. The specialty manufacturers publish energy consumption charts for inside vs outside temperatures but the 120V ones don't. Anyone have real data for this comparison?

I'm off grid, and use a Frigidaire 18CF top freezer, and it consumes just over 1KWh per day.

[russ]

Like elevator inspections in much of the world - done every 50 years or so - needed or not.

[Sunny Solar]

before 1995 vehicles in Australia had the dip tube to tell you when the tank was full but now they have automatic cut off at about 80% full.
90% of all taxis in Aus run on LPG. Its usually half the price of gasoline or here petrol. 75c V $1.50 a litre
But in Philippines they just fill the portable cylinders until the weight is correct. And no one seems to worry much about test dates . all is ok if the tank is nicely repainted before delivery. Appearance is most important.

[russ]

Was at Stanford when a tank transfer accident caused a large liquid hydrogen leak, which ignited. Fortunately nothing else close. The last thing the firemen wanted to do was extinguish the flame! They concentrated on cooling the outside of the tank (separating it from the flare with a wall of water) until, about 12 hours later, everything had burned off.

In the desert incident the leaking and burning bullet was manageable - the problem was the second tank that was boiling and ruptured - the expanding vapor cloud acts as an air fuel bomb - very nasty.

[williaty]

Wow, we're paying closer to $4/gal for LPG here.


So, several places on the net I've seen the statement that new, high-efficiency 120V fridges are so efficient now that they're about the same energy usage (via an inverter) as just buying a specialty 24V DC fridge. Is there any truth to this? On the one hand, I'd expect specialty built off-grid fridges to be the most efficient thing out there. On the other hand, energy usage is something appliances now compete on in big box stores, and that usually drives innovation. The specialty manufacturers publish energy consumption charts for inside vs outside temperatures but the 120V ones don't. Anyone have real data for this comparison?

[inetdog]

20 years back I was organizing safety instruction for a bunch of part timers for a test campaign we were running - to do with hydrogen and CO production. One film was called BLEVE (boiling liquid, evaporating vapor explosion). Rather vivid examples of what happens when a LPG bullet blows - it tends to clear out the surrounding area with the diameter set by the volume of the bullet.

One part was somewhere in the SW where firemen were trying to extinguish flames from one bullet when the second one besdie the burning one blew. Observers sitting along the road 1/4 mile away were turned into crispy critters. Doubt they found anything of the firemen.

Was at Stanford when a tank transfer accident caused a large liquid hydrogen leak, which ignited. Fortunately nothing else close. The last thing the firemen wanted to do was extinguish the flame! They concentrated on cooling the outside of the tank (separating it from the flare with a wall of water) until, about 12 hours later, everything had burned off.