LED or CFL ?

[SunEagle]

Navy to use LED lamps

Check out this news about LED lamps being used on Navy supply ships.

http://ewweb.com/lighting/revolution-lighting-technologies-provide-navy-supply-ships-17000-led-lamps?NL=EW-02&Issue=EW-02_20131217_EW-02_335&YM_RID=vince.ricca@psoglobal.com&YM_MID=1439920&sfvc4enews=42&cl=article_1_1

[SunEagle]

LED tubes guys? Sure you do not mean LED strips?

Bottom line LED's are not ready for area lighting yet. Once you look the real numbers the best LED's out there max efficiency is about 70 Lumens/watt which is what CFL's are at. LED's are great for TASK and ACCENT lighting but have a long way to go for interior area lighting. For interior T5HO is king at 100 to 105 Lumens/watt. I use quite a few of them especially in the kitchen for under and over the cabinet lighting with recessed cans using CFL.

Outside for security, landscaping, accent, and inside the garage is where I use LED's. Also in the garage I use T5HO 4 foot-4-tube fixtures to create the sun.

There are LED strips that are being sold but I purchased LED Tube lamps that look like a T8. The attached link shows a similar type that I have purchased but mine came from a US supplier. Some have a clear lens and show the individual LEDs other lamps have translucent lens which distribute the light more evenly but you lose a little too. Choice is up to the user.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/G13-T8-144-LEDs-3528-SMD-Warm-White-Fluorescent-Light-Lamp-Tube-60cm-AC-85-265V-/390649614216?pt=US_Light_Bulbs&hash=item5af4880f88

The only modifications needed is to remove the old ballast in the fixture and wire up the tombstone connectors directly to 120 volts. Just make sure they are rated at least 125volts.

Although the LED lamp manufacturers are also selling retro-fit that is easy to replace the existing ballast and terminations for the old fluorescent tubes so the LED tubes can go into the same fixture housing.

[paulcheung]

I haven't seen any T5 or T5HO tubes, so I can't say anything about them. How many watts is the T5HO 4'? if you have to change the ballast and the tube, it has more work to change them. The LED don't use ballast so I just cut the wire and connect to the tube. The T5 need new fixture or adapter, don't it?
How much is the T5HO 4 foot tube cost? My house is installed with 4' or 2' fluorescent tubes everywhere. The 4' LED tube is cost $2800 Ja. dollars each without the fixture. it is about $26 US each 18watts.

[Sunking]

LED tubes guys? Sure you do not mean LED strips?

Bottom line LED's are not ready for area lighting yet. Once you look the real numbers the best LED's out there max efficiency is about 70 Lumens/watt which is what CFL's are at. LED's are great for TASK and ACCENT lighting but have a long way to go for interior area lighting. For interior T5HO is king at 100 to 105 Lumens/watt. I use quite a few of them especially in the kitchen for under and over the cabinet lighting with recessed cans using CFL.

Outside for security, landscaping, accent, and inside the garage is where I use LED's. Also in the garage I use T5HO 4 foot-4-tube fixtures to create the sun.

[russ]

The lamps for my bike and hand lamp (flash light) are LED. Same for night lights in the home. The lighting along our drive is LED.

I too like LED and expect them to be better and better in time to come.

Sun Eagle told the story of the T5 well.

[SunEagle]

You sure those T5 tubes are not LED base? The LED tube I got are slimmer then the older ones. the colors I use are day light, both the older florescent tube and the new LED tubes.

The Dealers in Jamaica who promote the LED lights all have the P3 killawatt meter install on the shelf they display the LED lights. they have the older lights and tubes comparing with new LED lights and tubes.

The bottom line is it work for me, they are brighter than the old tube I replaced and use less than half the electricity. they make me off grid possible with a little life style change of course.

Cheers.

No. There is a definite difference between a T5 fluorescent tube lamp and and LED tube lamp.

A few years ago I was the Project Manager in charge of installing over 200 fluorescent T5 fixtures in most of the warehouses for the company I use to work for. Before we went with the T5 I performed all of the calculations to compared specific lamps to determine which was the most cost effective type. While at that time there wasn't a big selection of LED tubes but I did compare them. The T5 won out hands over fist in all of the comparisons which is why they were installed.

Since that big project the LED technology being used to retrofit fluorescent lamp fixtures has gotten much lower in price and better in performance but in most cases the LED's still don't beat the T5.

But I also believe in the LED technology which is why over the past couple of years I have installed in my home 5 x 18 watt 4' LED tube lamps and 4 x 10 watt 2' LED tube lamps. Most of them were purchased off of eBay and Amazon and they were not cheap. The retrofit was relatively easy and they do put out a lot of light and I am very happy with their performance. I know the LED will continue to improve in lumens per watt performance as well as come down in cost. But for now the T5 is still the best you can do.

[paulcheung]

You have two lamps from whatever manufacturer and make sweeping statements. Typically today the small diameter tube lamp t5 tube lamp is the most efficient.

You can find all kinds of colors and intensities.

You sure those T5 tubes are not LED base? The LED tube I got are slimmer then the older ones. the colors I use are day light, both the older fluorescent tube and the new LED tubes.

The Dealers in Jamaica who promote the LED lights all have the P3 killawatt meter install on the shelf they display the LED lights. they have the older lights and tubes comparing with new LED lights and tubes.

The bottom line is it work for me, they are brighter than the old tube I replaced and use less than half the electricity. they make me off grid possible with a little life style change of course.

Cheers.

[russ]

I use to use a trouble light with a 60 watt bulb under a cardboard box over my water softener which was located in my garage. It kept the piping from freezing on those cold winter nights in NJ. Don't need to worry now that I'm in Florida.

I remember placing one under the hood of the car and throwing a blanket over it for a bit of insulation - kept the oil from getting so thick you had no lubrication. A poor mans dip stick heater'which was a lousy thing as well.

[SunEagle]

I certainly hope not to use them up in my lifetime. The original collection was before there were
any options, or the energy concerns. At this point, I expect to walk into any of my buildings
(which see 20 below 0 F) and see INSTANT response from the lighting. Some sockets are so
seldom used, I can hardly justify high cost bulbs. I can afford good light around all those seldom
accessed shelves, turn on that incandescent a few times a year. The lights that do the long
time work are all fluorescent, but I need the incandescents too until they get warmed up.

Incandescent are good for a lot of stuff. Need a big resistor, they are cheap & compact. I
love them for energy efficient bleeders on DC power supplies. High resistance hot, it drops
dramatically cold to quickly absorb the last stored energy. A great debugging tool, as I have
pictured here. Honestly, I consider the screw in "green" stuff to be total junk and a fire hazard.

Did I mention, incandescents can make good heaters? Bruce Roe

I use to use a trouble light with a 60 watt bulb under a cardboard box over my water softener which was located in my garage. It kept the piping from freezing on those cold winter nights in NJ. Don't need to worry now that I'm in Florida.

[russ]

I use incandescents for the stairs where they are on motion sensors - in Turkey the generally ignore the bans.

However, the ban has made the lamp companies develop newer and better.

[bcroe]

Like to piss away power? That type of stockpiling has never made sense to me.

I certainly hope not to use them up in my lifetime. The original collection was before there were
any options, or the energy concerns. At this point, I expect to walk into any of my buildings
(which see 20 below 0 F) and see INSTANT response from the lighting. Some sockets are so
seldom used, I can hardly justify high cost bulbs. I can afford good light around all those seldom
accessed shelves, turn on that incandescent a few times a year. The lights that do the long
time work are all fluorescent, but I need the incandescents too until they get warmed up.

Incandescent are good for a lot of stuff. Need a big resistor, they are cheap & compact. I
love them for energy efficient bleeders on DC power supplies. High resistance hot, it drops
dramatically cold to quickly absorb the last stored energy. A great debugging tool, as I have
pictured here. Honestly, I consider the screw in "green" stuff to be total junk and a fire hazard.

Did I mention, incandescents can make good heaters? Bruce Roe

[russ]

When I got a house in 71 near Chi, I started cashing in the max number of bulbs every
month. I still haven't run out, though there is a massive stock of newer replacements
in the attic. I don't recall, a need to bring back the old bulbs. Bruce Roe

Like to piss away power? That type of stockpiling has never made sense to me.

[bcroe]

Back in Chicago in the pre-1960 days, Con Edison would supply free light bulbs to residential customers. They were all 130V type, so people had to use higher wattage bulbs to get the same amount of light, but they lasted a long time.
I believe several analysts calculated that Con Ed was actually making money off the free light bulbs, based on the increased power consumption.
(PS: Free in the sense that you could trade in a burnt-out bulb for a new one.)

When I got a house in 71 near Chi, I started cashing in the max number of bulbs every
month. I still haven't run out, though there is a massive stock of newer replacements
in the attic. I don't recall, a need to bring back the old bulbs. Bruce Roe

[inetdog]

You should experience the incandescent lamps we get here in India - the company pays the electric bill so guess who doesn't buy the more expensive CFL units. The average lamp may last one month with normal usage - some pop after a single day - they are cheap though.

Back in Chicago in the pre-1960 days, Con Edison would supply free light bulbs to residential customers. They were all 130V type, so people had to use higher wattage bulbs to get the same amount of light, but they lasted a long time.
I believe several analysts calculated that Con Ed was actually making money off the free light bulbs, based on the increased power consumption.

(PS: Free in the sense that you could trade in a burnt-out bulb for a new one.)

[SunEagle]

Someone has been drinking the Kool-Aid.

LOLOLOLOL. I guess I'm one of those kool-aid drinkers.

Don't get me wrong. If I had to light up an office building my first, second and third choice would be the T5 fluorescent. They are still the best bang for your buck in light output, energy conservation and in some cases lamp life.

But even though the T5's will stay on top as the best light source for a while there are more and more companies going with LED fixtures in office areas. I believe Prudential up in Boston is retrofitting the offices with LED fixtures. There was also a city in South Florida that was switching out their HID street lights to LED fixtures. Even the Department of Energy has been researching and starting to lean toward more LED type lighting for retrofits. There is a growing trend toward using the LED as they get better and better.

LED's cost more up front but will use much less energy then most of all other types of lighting sources and therefor eventually pay for their costs. The big savings though is not the energy cost but the reduced labor to maintain them. Based on their longer life (what that might actually be is still being determined but still pretty long) companies are calculating a lot of labor hours saved but not having to replaced them. That is the main motivating factor and cost justification.

So for some people it is a matter of preference to stay with the incandescent and others with fluorescent but LED's are here to stay and will eventually become the major source of man made light used. That's my story and I'm sticking to it. Now where's that kool-aid my cup is empty.