Built A tiny home, but it has solar issues

[The_realTW]

Chrisski,

I believe this is our guy, going to try it now!

http://www.lyonscomputer.com.au/Electronic-Devices/Battery-Meters/PZEM-015-Multifuctional-Battery-Meter/PZEM-015-Multifuctional-Battery-Meter.html

[The_realTW]

Before going to lithium’s there’s some steps to keep flooded lead acid batteries longer, like going to equalization mode an hour at a time until the cells are balanced. My cells were slightly out of balance when measured with a hydrometer, but after equalizing for only on hour, the specific gravity in each cell remained the same.

For a a good write up on equalization, check in the stickies in the battery section.

I think you have flooded lead acid batteries, and if so, an equalization could help.

Looking at the link you posted, that monitor may work. It looks like it is designed to hook into a shunt, and you already have one connected. One of the reviews talk about the instructions list the incorrect steps to cal the monitor. It’s a shame the monitor you have now comes without instructions. There’s gotta be a way to cal the one you have, but without instructions, there may as well not be.

The move to Lithium is more of the fact I want those batteries lighter, inside and not on the tongue, and even though they cost an arm and a leg you cannot argue (And believe me I have been trying to) the long term benefits of the technology of the LIPO4, I realize it will mean some serious cash, and probably redoing the entire system, but lets face it this system never worked properly.

As for equalization I saw something in the SCC about doing that once every 30 days, however I did not see a way to manually initiate it

that monitor may have something out there, ill do some digging

[chrisski]

Before going to lithium’s there’s some steps to keep flooded lead acid batteries longer, like going to equalization mode an hour at a time until the cells are balanced. My cells were slightly out of balance when measured with a hydrometer, but after equalizing for only on hour, the specific gravity in each cell remained the same.

For a a good write up on equalization, check in the stickies in the battery section.

I think you have flooded lead acid batteries, and if so, an equalization could help.

Looking at the link you posted, that monitor may work. It looks like it is designed to hook into a shunt, and you already have one connected. One of the reviews talk about the instructions list the incorrect steps to cal the monitor. It’s a shame the monitor you have now comes without instructions. There’s gotta be a way to cal the one you have, but without instructions, there may as well not be.

[The_realTW]

Would something like this work? I looked at the Victron monitor but it was close to 200 bucks! That is a bit pricey

https://www.amazon.com/Capacity-Percent-Battery-Monitor-0-120-0V/dp/B01FXQUMCG/ref=sr_1_19?dchild=1&keywords=solar+battery+monitor&qid=1620185753&sr=8-19

[The_realTW]

I use a hydrometer from an auto parts store.

Not the cheap one with three little floating pellets, but the one with a glass floaty. It may cost $8 to $12. No need for a temperature compensating $25 one if you can add or subtract based off temps.

Getting SOC from voltage is not always accurate; they need to sit idle a while, but the hydrometer won’t lie and will tell you which cells in both your batteries are good or bad.

Interesting, and your recommending I purchase one of these even though I fully intend to switch over to Lithium?

[chrisski]

I use a hydrometer from an auto parts store.

Not the cheap one with three little floating pellets, but the one with a glass floaty. It may cost $8 to $12. No need for a temperature compensating $25 one if you can add or subtract based off temps.

Getting SOC from voltage is not always accurate; they need to sit idle a while, but the hydrometer won’t lie and will tell you which cells in both your batteries are good or bad.

[The_realTW]

After a charge with your battery V @ 13.4 they are not at 99% charged so cant get you through the night, so you are correct your meter is not set up right.

Basically they will have now been grossly undercharged since the charge and test 2 weeks ago. If you do not get them charged back up properly they will be dead sooner rather than later.

Your only option to have a hope of saving these batteries at the moment is to use a generator to charge and a hydrometer to test SOC.

They did good last night, no alarms at all..

As for the meter I doubt there is anything that can fix that, its a 15 dollar cheapy

I charge them every night for three hours with the backfeed, if they die they die, I will be replacing them entirely anyway.

I only have the tiny home until Saturday, when it goes back in storage. I do not own a hydrometer. The SOC is probably accurate on the SCC panel, but I am unsure if it is on the meter itself.

[Bala]

Posting this to Kill two birds with one stone


last night I was at 29% battery (after a cloudy day) and I put the generator on and turned on the backfeed through the converter, I did this at 10pm- and at 1am I shut the generator down with the SOC on the SCC reading 13.4 volts and 99% charged. I went to bed soon after so obviously it didn’t stay that way, but those three hours seemed to help through the night, no more alarms.

obviously I want the whole night to pass with stored energy but these batteries (or the amount) just can’t do that. I always found that bizarre as it’s just the stupid fridge that is on when I’m in bed, anyway I digress.

ok that’s all for now, and chrisski, I’m still convinced that “monitor” is either not setup right or just won’t give me the info I need!

After a charge with your battery V @ 13.4 they are not at 99% charged so cant get you through the night, so you are correct your meter is not set up right.

Basically they will have now been grossly undercharged since the charge and test 2 weeks ago. If you do not get them charged back up properly they will be dead sooner rather than later.

Your only option to have a hope of saving these batteries at the moment is to use a generator to charge and a hydrometer to test SOC.

[The_realTW]

Posting this to Kill two birds with one stone

chrisski: no change on SOC level throughout the night or today

Bala: in answer to your question: the batteries were purchased in September 2020 brand new , even though it seems unlikely, they had to charge between the install (sept 2020) and me fixing the current issue (putting on the - lead back to the shunt from the SOC) even if very slowly. There is absolutely no way that I would have had ANY POWER at all if the batteries were not giving it.

also they were fully discharged and then charged back up at a Lincoln Interstate batteries outlet, and declared healthy. This took place two weeks ago.

everyone: the main issue was never whether the batteries were working or the panels, although I will admit that these other issues had us all looking for culprits. It comes back to the fact that this SCC, panel count, and battery count is just insufficient for the use cycle I wish to get from it.

last night I was at 29% battery (after a cloudy day) and I put the generator on and turned on the backfeed through the converter, I did this at 10pm- and at 1am I shut the generator down with the SOC on the SCC reading 13.4 volts and 99% charged. I went to bed soon after so obviously it didn’t stay that way, but those three hours seemed to help through the night, no more alarms.

obviously I want the whole night to pass with stored energy but these batteries (or the amount) just can’t do that. I always found that bizarre as it’s just the stupid fridge that is on when I’m in bed, anyway I digress.

the main point is I am going to design a system that has more PV Absorption, more stored capacity, and a faster SCC, also I want to set something up that will allow the panels to be manipulated during the day. I’m looking at tracking systems but they are very heavy (maybe I can build a turret lol) but I am also looking at adjustable rails that can be moved throughout the day, although ideally I could get enough to lay them flat and just get my power that way.

this is obviously a developing situation and more will unfold as we progress,

ok that’s all for now, and chrisski, I’m still convinced that “monitor” is either not setup right or just won’t give me the info I need!

[Bala]

I WANT TO BE CLEAR I MEANT NO OFFENSE, EVERYONE is welcome and needed here. I did not mean for my post to sound short. Your "Different perspective" is completely welcome.

No offense taken, but you didnt reply to my question, I will ask another,


You say your batteries are good, what test have you done to determine that they are good?

[The_realTW]

The top two wires are empty.

The bottom red and black shoulf go through the wall to the respective batttery + and - terminals. This reads voltage.

The Middle two get routed to the shunt. THe blue wire gets connected to the part of the shunt that is closest to the battery. The yellow wire gets connected to the opposite terminal of the shunt. This reads amps.

With no loads on, the battery monitor should be pretty close to what the solar panel is putting out for charging amps. If the SOC is staying at 100% all the time, may be that the amp cables (blue and yellow) are backwards. Needs a negative amps to go below 100%. Kind of hard o tell from the pic, but appears yellow and blue may be reversed at the shunt. If this is true, charging with the solar panel will read a negative amperage.

IMG_8180.JPG

Ok I reversed the wires, here is the readout now, I am currently backfeeding the generator through the converter, the inverter and solar system side are powered down.

You will need to adjust the monitor to the correct size in AH for the battery you have for the SOC tone accurate.

IMG_8181.JPG

No clue how to do that as this thing does not seem to be programmable

SOC is unchanged.

I can try to shut the backfeed down in a couple hours and see if SOC moves

[chrisski]

The top two wires are empty.

The bottom red and black shoulf go through the wall to the respective batttery + and - terminals. This reads voltage.

The Middle two get routed to the shunt. THe blue wire gets connected to the part of the shunt that is closest to the battery. The yellow wire gets connected to the opposite terminal of the shunt. This reads amps.

With no loads on, the battery monitor should be pretty close to what the solar panel is putting out for charging amps. If the SOC is staying at 100% all the time, may be that the amp cables (blue and yellow) are backwards. Needs a negative amps to go below 100%. Kind of hard o tell from the pic, but appears yellow and blue may be reversed at the shunt. If this is true, charging with the solar panel will read a negative amperage.

You will need to adjust the monitor to the correct size in AH for the battery you have for the SOC tone accurate.

[The_realTW]

A battery monitor will be hooked up something like this. The shunt in the break between the two big negative cables measures amps. The small red wire measures volts. The gray wire goes to the Monitor that calculates SOC, tells discharge amperage, gives alarms, etc.
Battery Monitor.jpg

Essentially, this monitor has 4 cables, Red + Black - and a yellow and blue cable, those are for (going to the wall brb) Ok I just took a photo of the backside of it after digging it out of the wall, maybe you can make sense of it and if its hooked up right

Keep in mind before I started swapping wires, I had nothing on that thing at all, now it shows data, whether its accurate or useful is of course a whole notha story

IMG_8179.JPG

[chrisski]

A battery monitor will be hooked up something like this. The shunt in the break between the two big negative cables measures amps. The small red wire measures volts. The gray wire goes to the Monitor that calculates SOC, tells discharge amperage, gives alarms, etc.
Battery Monitor.jpg

[The_realTW]

If you could get the battery monitor working, that could get some good info also. I look at that quite a bit to when I turn a load on to see if it is draining the battery, or I'm producing enough solar to keep the device on. I use the monitor to decide when to turn my fridge from electric in the day to gas at night. At night, I will turn a devices on and off to see where my draws are coming from. I had about seven incandescent bulbs I found by seeing they had an unusually large draw. I also found my wife had snuck an electric food warmer that was pulling up to 1000 watts when in turned the heating element on. My 4 gold cart batteries could not sustain that overnight.

Some shunts are compatible with different battery monitors, and are plug and play. My Victron comes with instructions on how to connect a non-Victron Shunt. I'm sure other brands do the same. My shunt cable is a standard RJ12 cable.

Could also be as simple as the cable from the shunt to the battery monitor being shot. My cable came with something like 25' of wire, and I wish I could trim it down to about 5'. Could be if yours is the same, the installer messed the cable up and that could be why its not working. When I get around to making that interface cable shorter, I'm sure I'll mess it up also.

I am laughing so hard at her sneaking the cooker in. I presume you mean "Golf cart" batteries.

The issue with the meter is I DO NOT know which one to buy, but I will tell you this, the cheap one installed is hooked up correctly, and there is no wire damage as no "installer" hooked that up, I did that one myself. I just do not think it works very well. I thought I had mentioned that in troubleshooting the solar stuff I had fixed that as well. The issue with the meter and the "SCC Panel" is I believe all that is "instant" and not "cumulative" readouts.

For example, lets say the solar is at 99% while I am charging it with the generator. The moment I turn the backfeed switch off it goes to 70-60 percent. Another one is when I turn the toaster on (That is a real killer), the battery percent will drop down to 0% battery power, but we all know there is juice in the batteries, the moment the toast pops up it goes back to 70% , so I never know just how much "juice" is really in those things. I would like something to tell me how many "AMP HOURS" are in the batteries, and also how many I am putting back in, whether it be by the sun, or by the generator.

A good meter hooked up to the shunt ( I am guessing that is where it would have to hook in) would probably tell the true tale of what is going on.

A current photo of the "meter" that is hooked up now, probably a lot of that is accurate to the "instant" except the SOC, that thing is always at 100% even when the LVDC alarms are going off. I also see no buttons to reset anything, although if I hold the on/off button it does allow me to cycle through the settings, but does not let me alter them or reset anything.

IMG_8176.JPG