2000k system only puts out 500 watt why?

[charles2,david000k]

another question which I keep forgetting to ask is I have a old school analog meter. The residential kind that goes on the outside of your home when the meter guy us to come to your home and read the thing before smart meters took over. I got a brand new one never used still in the box will it accurately read DC power output? I originally got it to put between my inverter and 200amp service panel either way I am going to use it but I thought it would be a interesting question due to the fact the guy on ebay who sold it to me had no ideal.

[charles2,david000k]

Yes, you've got it! To measure Isc with your Renogy meter (no battery involved), connect the + lead from the panel(s) to the Source Red wire, connect the - lead from the panel(s) to the Source Black wire. On the Load side of the meter, short the red and black wires together.

Edit:
Note that the meter is itself powered by whatever you are trying to measure, which could be responsible for some of the current you were measuring in the open circuit results you posted previously (although 40 W is much more than the meter alone should take). From the online manual, it looks like there is a way to provide auxiliary power to the meter so that it does not interfere with the measurement, but it isn't perfectly clear how to do it. The Isc test might not generate enough voltage to actually power the meter, so don't freak out if the meter doesn't turn on when you try it

Ya its a three pin connection I found one on a old pc board I had laying around and it takes a 4.8v to 60v input on the three pin input but I am just going to wire a 9 volt to it. But anyone else who tries this remember you have to remove ALL power to reset the meter's memory. I just personally see no point in spending 9 10 buck on something I already have. yep just did it the 9 volt works great! I will redo the readings on panel number one this sunday rain is supposed to move in early morning and hang around till saturday night.

[sensij]

I have a ideal rolling around in my head that I think might work but am unsure and don't want to blow out this new watts up meter. connect the source wire directly to the panel like I did today then take the load side of the watts up meter and connect negative to positive. In my head this would work it would just be competing the circuit or am I crazy and going to blow my meter up?

Yes, you've got it! To measure Isc with your Renogy meter (no battery involved), connect the + lead from the panel(s) to the Source Red wire, connect the - lead from the panel(s) to the Source Black wire. On the Load side of the meter, short the red and black wires together.

Edit:
Note that the meter is itself powered by whatever you are trying to measure, which could be responsible for some of the current you were measuring in the open circuit results you posted previously (although 40 W is much more than the meter alone should take). From the online manual, it looks like there is a way to provide auxiliary power to the meter so that it does not interfere with the measurement, but it isn't perfectly clear how to do it. The Isc test might not generate enough voltage to actually power the meter, so don't freak out if the meter doesn't turn on when you try it

[charles2,david000k]

It looks like you are measuring an open circuit with a small leak. If your battery voltage and PV voltage are not identical, then you know that the PV array is not connected to the battery.

To take the battery condition out of the mix, you could first try measuring Isc for each panel.

When you are ready to do live testing with the battery, make sure it has discharged past the point at which you told your relay to turn off, below 23.9 V. Otherwise, the relay will be active, and will prevent your array from connecting to the battery. I would suggest returning the relay to its default settings (28.8 and 27.2 V) so that you don't need to discharge the battery so deeply to get the relay to turn off.

I have a ideal rolling around in my head that I think might work but am unsure and don't want to blow out this new watts up meter. connect the source wire directly to the panel like I did today then take the load side of the watts up meter and connect negative to positive. In my head this would work it would just be competing the circuit or am I crazy and going to blow my meter up?

[sensij]

It looks like you are measuring an open circuit with a small leak. If your battery voltage and PV voltage are not identical, then you know that the PV array is not connected to the battery.

To take the battery condition out of the mix, you could first try measuring Isc for each panel.

When you are ready to do live testing with the battery, make sure it has discharged past the point at which you told your relay to turn off, below 23.9 V. Otherwise, the relay will be active, and will prevent your array from connecting to the battery. I would suggest returning the relay to its default settings (28.8 and 27.2 V) so that you don't need to discharge the battery so deeply to get the relay to turn off.

[charles2,david000k]

update 11/11/2015

Ok so I tested panels number one all day and these are my findings

10:15 am 35.43V 0.45A 15.9W at 69F

11am 34.70V 1.11A 38.5W at 69F

1:45pm 34.84V 1.24A 42.6W at 68F

2:40pm 35.09V 1.16A 40.06W at 68F

3:26pm 35.02V 0.96A 33.02W at 69F

4pm 35.02V 0.83A 29.02W at 67F

These reading below I am not quite sure of what they are I just wrote them down at the end of the day I will have to consult the operation manual. sorry for the edit. Wh=watt hours, Vm=minimum volts, Ah= Amp hours, Ap= Amp peak, Wp= Watt peak
Wh 239.
Vm 29.81
Ah 6.899
Ap 5.32
Wp 180.02
panels specs below

Nominal peak power(Pmax) 240Wp 245Wp 250Wp
Maximum power voltage(Vmp) 30.65V 30.8V 30.91V
Maximum power current(Imp) 7.83A 7.96A 8.09A
Short-circuit current(Isc) 8.36A 8.49A 8.62A
Open circuit voltage(Voc) 37.8V 37.98V 38.11V
Optimized cell efficiency(η） 17.00% 17.40% 17.60%

[charles2,david000k]

Those issues don't sound all that good, you need to compare the Voc on the panels and see if the ones that changed color the most have the lowest Voc? The panel I tested the other day was a 72 cell Mono (new), and I could not quite hit Voc, but because of the time of year I didn't think too much of it, I am at 46.25 lat. and even midday the sun is not all that high.

Don't feel bad I was going to buy another panel of the same make and model but the manufacture pulled them all off ebay and the distributors have jacked their prices up sky high. An I refuse to buy another one of these panels unless it is directly from the manufacturer to avoid the warranty issue. If you don't buy direct they are not really warranted.

[charles2,david000k]

Just to let you guys know I did not forget about you I got the first meter in the mail yesterday night and have set it up to track the power output all day today since we are having a perfect day with absolutely no clouds and a cool temp of 69 to 68 today but am very unhappy with the amps it has been tracking for the day of 1.5 at my last check I am trying to check in and write down readings every hour but life is a busy thing.

[LETitROLL]

I still have a gut feeling though the voltage drop has something to do with the solder strip peeling up off the cell inside the panel or poor quality silicon if that is possible. I say poor quality silicon only because the cells themselves changed color from a really nice dark dark blue to a white blue almost white in three months of exposure to the sun. some of the panels changed color not all of them.

Those issues don't sound all that good, you need to compare the Voc on the panels and see if the ones that changed color the most have the lowest Voc? The panel I tested the other day was a 72 cell Mono (new), and I could not quite hit Voc, but because of the time of year I didn't think too much of it, I am at 46.25 lat. and even midday the sun is not all that high.

[LETitROLL]

How much power would you have to pull from a panel to do a correct load test on a panel granted all weather conditions and panel position are correct?
Could you use something like a small 12v or 24v DC car light as a load?

Voc (open circuit voltage) is of course taken without a load and will/should give you the maximum voltage reading you are going to see from a given panel, as an increasing load is put on it the voltage will somewhat sag depending on the amount of current flow. What to use for a test load just depends on what you are trying to accomplish, to find out the maximum capabilities of a panel usually you just check the Voc, and then I put my meter on 10A setting and go straight to the factory pigtail + to + and - to - for a short circuit through the meter and see how many amps I can pull. I checked a new panel I had in the house the other day and set it out on the porch as square to the sun as possible, the panel is rated at Voc = 45.8 and Vmp =36.2 and I got 45.1 initially, it was about 55 degrees out and as the panel warmed up my voltage went down about .1V every 30 seconds, then I checked the short circuit current and was just slightly about the rated Isc.

[charles2,david000k]

what? never said anything about dumping electrolyte . was talking about scrap batteries. said if a scrap battery has black electrolyte the plates are gone. if the electrolyte is clear in most cases you can recover the battery with an equalizing charge. has worked out for me. essentially im getting free batteries. buy them for scrap value. have recovered under half of them to 100% SOC. get money back on the batteries that are stuffed. even when the good ones are finished i will get my money back on those as well. so far they are still performing just fine

Sorry lol you're right that is not what you said. I was in a hurry it was halloween night and the kids were killing me to go trick or treating. But after rereading and watching a few videos this guy sounds like you and him are about on the same page. I watch videos because I happen to be a visual hands on learner. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6x-JfckAt20

[charles2,david000k]

Question for the group?

How much power would you have to pull from a panel to do a correct load test on a panel granted all weather conditions and panel position are correct?
Could you use something like a small 12v or 24v DC car light as a load?

[almac]

So one lead acid battery dump the acid and check the color when I do to see if it's black. If it is not black refill with distilled water not sulfuric acid. then just keep charging it until it holds a charge again.

what? never said anything about dumping electrolyte . was talking about scrap batteries. said if a scrap battery has black electrolyte the plates are gone. if the electrolyte is clear in most cases you can recover the battery with an equalizing charge. has worked out for me. essentially im getting free batteries. buy them for scrap value. have recovered under half of them to 100% SOC. get money back on the batteries that are stuffed. even when the good ones are finished i will get my money back on those as well. so far they are still performing just fine

[inetdog]

So one lead acid battery dump the acid and check the color when I do to see if it's black. If it is not black refill with distilled water not sulfuric acid. then just keep charging it until it holds a charge again.

That is one of the most ridiculous bits of advice I have seen in a long time.

[charles2,david000k]

there is nothing to it. forget about "smart chargers" because they are not smarter than you are. smart chargers wont restore a sulfate caked battery. get a cheap old dumb charger or dc power supply , set the voltage under 15v. even 14v will work if you leave it on long enough. same goes for CCs the solar hours are not long enough for "smart" charging the 3 stage bulk float absorb. set the voltage on a 24v system by checking your batteries SG weekly. if they are not 100% SOC at days end then up the voltage . i set my 24v CCs at about 29v this time of year. (spring in australia)

So one lead acid battery dump the acid and check the color when I do to see if it's black. If it is not black refill with distilled water not sulfuric acid. then just keep charging it until it holds a charge again.