2000k system only puts out 500 watt why?

[Raul]

I read followed your tread with interes like many others so I can learn from others mistakes . Stop buying cheap , please save your money and get a decent mppt CC. It will be the best investment , if you have done that in the first place it would of saved you the previous batteries and the spare cash for other thinks . Those panels are are good GT panels and will work wonders with a mppt CC . It dose not matter if they factory low grade rejects they still do the job for the money you paid . You want premium you pay premium . Your next requirement is a CC that takes a minimum of 150vdc and good to go . Go for cheap PWM and you will never see absorb or equalise then you will look for more batteries again.

[almac]

I really like the looks of the midnite solar classic lite. I think I might wait for taxes and buy one of their MPPT cc. Or one of these cheaper once like http://www.ebay.com/itm/25A-300W-MPP...-/130616352324
But I would really like to know what the RJ phone jack is for it doesn't seem like anyone doing reviews knows what it is for? I like the reviews i've seen on it so far though for the price. That jack has to be there for some thing either for factory programing or customer monitoring but which is it.

that CC in the link you provided is for 12v batteries only. my 1st CC was a MPPT and it did not charge my 24v batteries . i wasted alot of $$$ and time because of this CC. i suspect your problem is your CC , you alluded to that at the begining of this thread, you suspected the CC was rubbish. you will find that your panels are fine. if the voltage and current on each individual panel checks ok then there is nothing wrong with them

[charles2,david000k]

That panel is a 60 cell panel intended for grid tie installs. It is NOT intended to charge 24 volt battery systems although they may work with some caveats. (Cool temperatures, low loss wiring.) The issue is that they will barely get the batteries to the ~2.45 volts per cell you'll need for absorb.

That's about right for those panels. Open circuit voltage is around 38 volts at 25C, so if your panels are reaching 50C in the sunlight that's the approximate voltage you will see.

I didn't design the system I just told the seller I wanted a 2,000 watt system with the ability to add up to 6,000 watts worth of panels to later. O well I feel a little dumb now I just really dug into the inverter manual and the inverter is also a mppt charge controler.

[charles2,david000k]

charles my panels have the same specs as yours. grid tie 36v 250w. and they can charge a 24v system beautifully. you simply need the right CC. go fo a cheap PWM CC like mine. i used 2 x 30amp PWM CCs with 6 x 250w panels 3 each in parallel it charges my 330amp 24v bank in no time. here is a link to my cheapo off grid system. http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/showth...ff-grid-system but go to the end of the thread because i improved the setup over time

I really like the looks of the midnite solar classic lite. I think I might wait for taxes and buy one of their MPPT cc. Or one of these cheaper once like http://www.ebay.com/itm/25A-300W-MPP...-/130616352324
But I would really like to know what the RJ phone jack is for it doesn't seem like anyone doing reviews knows what it is for? I like the reviews i've seen on it so far though for the price. That jack has to be there for some thing either for factory programing or customer monitoring but which is it.

[almac]

charles have a look at these 2 pics of my 24v system

DSCN8679[1].JPGDSCN8684[1].JPG

i get 1000w at 28v to my batteries. from this 1.5kw panel array with 2 x 30amp $40 CCs

hope you didnt pay too much for this setup

[charles2,david000k]

That panel is a 60 cell panel intended for grid tie installs. It is NOT intended to charge 24 volt battery systems although they may work with some caveats. (Cool temperatures, low loss wiring.) The issue is that they will barely get the batteries to the ~2.45 volts per cell you'll need for absorb.

That's about right for those panels. Open circuit voltage is around 38 volts at 25C, so if your panels are reaching 50C in the sunlight that's the approximate voltage you will see.

So basicly just wait until the same time of year I got and set up the panels and everything should just return to normal?

[almac]

why is this so difficult?

charles my panels have the same specs as yours. grid tie 36v 250w. and they can charge a 24v system beautifully. you simply need the right CC. go fo a cheap PWM CC like mine. i used 2 x 30amp PWM CCs with 6 x 250w panels 3 each in parallel it charges my 330amp 24v bank in no time. here is a link to my cheapo off grid system. http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/showth...ff-grid-system but go to the end of the thread because i improved the setup over time

[jflorey2]

I was told they are American made in California but when I tracked them down they are made in Korea PS6A-250

That panel is a 60 cell panel intended for grid tie installs. It is NOT intended to charge 24 volt battery systems although they may work with some caveats. (Cool temperatures, low loss wiring.) The issue is that they will barely get the batteries to the ~2.45 volts per cell you'll need for absorb.

I checked again to keep you all updated 33.2 to 33.6 on 6 panels and panel 7 is at 34.2 clear blue skies temp about 70F

That's about right for those panels. Open circuit voltage is around 38 volts at 25C, so if your panels are reaching 50C in the sunlight that's the approximate voltage you will see.

[charles2,david000k]

Somehow we just need to simplify this and get down the the basic fact of whether your panel(s) are actually defective in some way and losing efficiency that rapidly (not likely, but possible), or something else is going on. Have you (lately) unhooked the connectors right at a panel and taken a voltage reading straight from a single panel (no extra wiring, just the factory pigtail) from a meter that is trusted, and best if early on cool sunny day. There are so many things that can make them vary, including time of year, moisture in cable(s) or connections, or degredation of connections, just eliminate all that and take multiple readings over a day or 2 directly from one or more panels and I think you will get to a final answer quicker.

Yesterday, 01:22 PM it is post #66


I checked again to keep you all updated 33.2 to 33.6 on 6 panels and panel 7 is at 34.2 clear blue skies temp about 70F and sun almost straight up in the sky. All the panel were test by themselves disconnected from everything else reading were taken from panel mc-4 connectors . or pigtail

I hate to do it but I might end up buying another panels just like these to set up with the rest to help get rid of all these factor it's either that or a enphase grid tie inverter but it looks like a expensive set up just to track output and still does not solve angle, humidity, extra but if the panels are junk I don't want to be stuck with another one.


In my personal non professional opinion I think they are buying factory defect panels from SolarFennel Corp and passing them off as A grade. The big reason I feel this way is voltage drop, solder bubbles on cells, and some yellowish browning on the solder tabs under the glass inside the panels. I was told they are American made in California but when I tracked them down they are made in Korea PS6A-250

[charles2,david000k]

But if the lighting was powered by the city grid, any power would be gain. I think it would be an interesting experiment. I watched the battery climb to 13v before it was disconnected from that panel. This was only a few minute test. I think theres a significant amperage considering the light source.

I think your talking about getting light from a street light pole that might work but not for me. Here if you want a street light you have to pay for it. All the power company does is come out and hang it up on the pole and hook it into the grid then they charge you $17 a month added to your bill for the power you pull.

[LETitROLL]

That is why I hired a licensed professional to check the system.
I fully understand that! This is my big problem with the merchant. I started off with 8 panels and are now down to 7 with the rest following the same pattern as the first. volts and current drop the first panel dropped to 25 volts before they had me cut into the junction box and voided warranty just to look at some diodes.

Somehow we just need to simplify this and get down the the basic fact of whether your panel(s) are actually defective in some way and losing efficiency that rapidly (not likely, but possible), or something else is going on. Have you (lately) unhooked the connectors right at a panel and taken a voltage reading straight from a single panel (no extra wiring, just the factory pigtail) from a meter that is trusted, and best if early on cool sunny day. There are so many things that can make them vary, including time of year, moisture in cable(s) or connections, or degredation of connections, just eliminate all that and take multiple readings over a day or 2 directly from one or more panels and I think you will get to a final answer quicker.

[charles2,david000k]

I have heard the opposite. That in cold temperatures one must be careful not to allow the panels to exceed the input of charge controllers because output rises at colder temperatures.

Is it possible that is what they were trying to describe?

hot equals less power. cold equals more power from what I am picking up from every one here. But Missouri Wind and Solar said the opisat. They said the cold drains the panels causing them to put out less power like a battery and hot equals more power like warming up a gas motor. I have a audio recording but the audio is to soft compared to background noise some one would have to clean it up.

[charles2,david000k]

If it was just one or two panels, this would be easier to suspect. For the same voltage drop to have occurred in all of them seems like something more systematic.

That is why I hired a licensed professional to check the system.
I fully understand that! This is my big problem with the merchant. I started off with 8 panels and are now down to 7 with the rest following the same pattern as the first. volts and current drop the first panel dropped to 25 volts before they had me cut into the junction box and voided warranty just to look at some diodes.

Grounding Is a 30ft bare braided 4 awg wire hooked directly to each panel then run to it's own grounding rod. I actually got the wire from the power company during a past ice storm. When the power company comes through during a ice storm they don't do clean up at all most the time they just leave their waste behind and I went out and asked for what they were going to leave so all and all I got a bunch of stuff nothing really cool though like a transformer just wire and a couple of poles and what I think might be a good transformer fuse. But my ground wire is rated for pole to home service drop which here is 220V @200 amp I think. the wire is 7 or 8 aluminum strands of 12 awg wire braided around a peace of 12 awg stainless steel wire. just went and checked to be double sure the ground wire is 1/4inch thick.

[jflorey2]

See missouri Wind and solar told me the panel puts out more power as it warmed up or gets hotter and when the panel get cooler or colder it puts out less power. So they lied to me correct?

Voltage drops significantly as temperature rises. Current rises _slightly_ as temperature rises. Overall power goes down.

[almac]

my 2c charles

when i started my solar setup with alot of wonderful help from members here, thanks guys. got what i needed to know about batteries from sunking and bala and others, plus plenty of knowledgeable advice on everything solar all for free. what i did find out for myself is that some products are rubbish, particularly some charge controllers. and price doesnt indicate good design. my 1st CC was marketed as a MPPT cost $270 and did not put out enough current to charge my batteries. this CC was a setback. i spent money on petrol generators and dc power supplies to charge my batteries because the CC was rubbish. me not knowing that my panels were more than adequate in producing current did not suspect the CC. tried a replacement CC same model no improvement. then got a refund. then bought 2 very cheap PWM CCs at $40 each off ebay , they worked great, didnt need the gen anymore now have more power than i can use.