Inverter with Generator Start

[Soulearner]

Greetings,
Perhaps my search terms are inaccurate, or I don't know what I am looking for, but I am trying to find an inverter that will automatically start the generator. I can't seem to find one.
Appreciate any help.

[Mike90250]

Greetings,
Perhaps my search terms are inaccurate, or I don't know what I am looking for, but I am trying to find an inverter that will automatically start the generator. I can't seem to find one.
Appreciate any help.

These will be mostly the high end inverters, and they will have a "user defined control" that can be used to signal most anything.
Then you get a Generator module, and that does the work. And you have to have a compatible generator, with either a 2 wire start or a 3 wire start

http://www.xantrex.com/power-products/power-accessories/automatic-generator-start.aspx

[inetdog]

And you have to have a compatible generator, with either a 2 wire start or a 3 wire start

Including either an automatic choke or no need for a choke.
Ask Chris Olson about starting generators in winter.

[ChrisOlson]

Including either an automatic choke or no need for a choke.
Ask Chris Olson about starting generators in winter.

Yeah. We have a 75 watt heat lamp shining on the base of the cylinder on our auto-start generator so it will start in the winter. To get the prime genset started we have to start the auto-start standby unit and heat it up to 70 degrees in the generator room, which pre-heats the other one to get that started. Living in the frozen north is really fun

To answer the OP's question, check out Schneider Conext inverters and Magnum Energy inverters. They both have advanced auto-gen starting with gen controllers. Outback inverters can start a genset too, but they just use an aux port to signal a generator to start or stop, and this requires a much more expensive generator that has a built-in controller.

If you have an inverter that does not have any sort of generator control functions, you can also start and stop a generator based on system voltage (battery volts) with a Morningstar RD-1 relay driver.

[FlyLow]

I have read more bad than good about the Xantrex stuff and that's what lead me to Magnum energy.

The magnum auto gen start is awesome, there are tons of parameters to set to get it just how you like it. You can set the current for x amount of time for the gen to come on, set exercise, etc. it will require all magnum parts for it to work together FYI. One feature i really like about the inverter is i can digitally set the max output current. This is to protect batteries for loads they should not be handling and the gen kicks on and takes the load off the batteries. I use the full suite of magnum pieces to give me peace of mind that my batteries are never below my set point.

[ChrisOlson]

Those types of settings are pretty standard, even with the Outback systems, including start/stop on SOC instead of using battery voltage. The SOC start/stop prevents using your generator to absorb batteries, which wastes a lot of fuel:





What you won't find in the Outback systems is this sort of stuff:







The reason is because the AGS (Automatic Generator Start) on both the Schneider Conext and Magnum Energy systems is a programmable controller and they work with just about any generator out there that has electric start. Even one that don't have an automatic choke because you can use Relay 3 (pre-heat for a diesel) to operate a linear actuator to choke/unchoke a gas engine for starting.

The Outback system is different and it is designed only for use with two-wire generators. Robin Gudgel, now with MidNite Solar but used to own Outback Power before the Alpha Group bought them, told me once that the reason they did that is because somebody came up with the wild idea that "real" generators are two-wire start. I told Robin that's the biggest load of crap I ever heard. Because they just eliminated about 99% of the pre-combustion diesels out there that can't be used with an Outback system unless you want to buy a $500 Atkinson generator controller and hack it onto the generator. The real reason they did that is to keep costs down because Xantrex was kicking their ass with the XW system and they had nothing to compete with it. So they sold on price point with the Outback systems being $2,000 cheaper than a Xantrex because it didn't have either the hardware or the features.

This is important to know when buying an off-grid power system that you intend to install an auto-start genset on. You can save some bucks on a Outback and find the auto-start gen settings in the Mate3. But when it comes to hooking up the genset better go take out a bank loan.

[Soulearner]

What a huge wealth information and experience. I have a few DAYS of research and reading to conduct, then may return for a few more focused questions.

I don't understand this sentence:
" The SOC start/stop prevents using your generator to absorb batteries..."
Absorb?

[inetdog]

What a huge wealth information and experience. I have a few DAYS of research and reading to conduct, then may return for a few more focused questions.

I don't understand this sentence:
" The SOC start/stop prevents using your generator to absorb batteries..."
Absorb?

Absorb is the name given to the second stage of three stage battery charging in which the voltage is held constant and the current slowly decreases. Using the generator to run and supply less than full output is usually inefficient and is actually bad for a diesel engine driving a generator.
The three stages are named:
1. Bulk (constant current or at least the largest current that the PV or generator can produce at any given time.
2. Absorb (constant voltage but decreasing current.)
3. Float (switch to a lower constant voltage just to balance out the self discharge of the battery or in some cases to complete charging if the Absorb cycle was too short.
You never want to use a generator for Float unless it would already be on at that time to supply other large loads.

[ChrisOlson]

Thanks for that inetdog - I sometimes get ahead of myself, forgetting that I have been working with this stuff for years and other folks might not know all the fine details.

To expand on that, when you set up your auto-start generator you'll set how many amps is allowable into the system from your generator to prevent overloading the genset. The inverter will automatically adjust the amount of power the battery charger takes to power your loads and charge batteries at the same time, keeping the generator at or near its rated power output. This provides very efficient operation of your generator, since generators are most efficient when loaded at 80% rated load or better.

During the absorb charging stage, the amount of power the battery charger takes starts to drop. So if the loads remain constant, as the amount of power the charger takes starts to "dial back" it will unload your generator so it is operating at less than the most efficient power level.

For grid backup generators, the genset is usually sized to run at 50% rated load with the remaining generator capacity used for surge loading. For battery and inverter systems for off-grid power the generator must be sized to run at 80% rated or better with normal loads on, combined with peak battery charging load. The inverter system has these settings that you can adjust to make best use of your fuel so you're not running the generator at less than peak efficiency.

[Soulearner]

Very clear. I understand and will begin my research much more focused. Thanks all!