HELP: Inverter is draining battery almost instantly! Why?

[spoon]

There are a couple of good indications that this is really a flooded battery and not a true sealed battery:

1. magic eye charge indicator
2. Maintenance free

The second phrase is an indication that it is the high fill electrolyte, hard to open cap, variety of flooded cell.
The first tells us for sure, since a magic eye indicator relies on a floating specific gravity indicator, requiring free liquid electrolyte.

The bench charge rate is the C/10 rate (C₂₀/10) and you should not generally exceed this rate when charging.
For your battery this appears to be 6A, and if you put two batteries in parallel you would charge that bank at up to 12A.

The PDF also shows a range of VRLA (truly sealed) batteries in either AGM or GEL type. AGM is the one which is good for RE applications. GEL batteries are too easily damaged by high charging current.

So, essentially this battery is no good for the purpose I am using it for. Even less so if I change CC's to the victron 30a?

[inetdog]

Can you tell from this picture? http://leisurebatteriesdirect.ie/num...battery-110ah/

Here is the chart: http://thebatterycentreevesham.co.uk...cification.pdf

There are a couple of good indications that this is really a flooded battery and not a true sealed battery:

1. magic eye charge indicator
2. Maintenance free

The second phrase is an indication that it is the high fill electrolyte, hard to open cap, variety of flooded cell.
The first tells us for sure, since a magic eye indicator relies on a floating specific gravity indicator, requiring free liquid electrolyte.

The bench charge rate is the C/10 rate (C₂₀/10) and you should not generally exceed this rate when charging.
For your battery this appears to be 6A, and if you put two batteries in parallel you would charge that bank at up to 12A.

The PDF also shows a range of VRLA (truly sealed) batteries in either AGM or GEL type. AGM is the one which is good for RE applications. GEL batteries are too easily damaged by high charging current.

[spoon]

Can you tell from this picture? http://leisurebatteriesdirect.ie/num...battery-110ah/

Here is the chart: http://thebatterycentreevesham.co.uk...cification.pdf

So, now the thinking is that my battery is also no good as it won't take a charge above 8a? Seems strange that it would have such a low charging a.

I'm still holding fire on getting the victron 100/30 until I get everything correctly in place.

My Ctek 7 stage smart charger arrived though and has charged one of the Numaxs' really well, and it has held voltage no problem overnight... So some good news in that at least one of the batteries isn't duff, even if it is innappropriate!

[lkruper]

Some newcomers to the area will see a "maintenance free" battery and not realize that it is NOT a sealed battery at all, just a Flooded Lead Acid (FLA) battery with extra room above the plates for spare electrolyte and vent caps that are very hard to open. You can manage to open the valve covers and measure the Specific Gravity (SG) with a temperature compensated hydrometer.
It is totally different from a sealed (Valve Regulated) lead acid battery which could be either AGM or GEL type.

Can you tell from this picture? http://leisurebatteriesdirect.ie/num...battery-110ah/

Here is the chart: http://thebatterycentreevesham.co.uk...cification.pdf

[inetdog]

Some newcomers to the area will see a "maintenance free" battery and not realize that it is NOT a sealed battery at all, just a Flooded Lead Acid (FLA) battery with extra room above the plates for spare electrolyte and vent caps that are very hard to open. You can manage to open the valve covers and measure the Specific Gravity (SG) with a temperature compensated hydrometer.
It is totally different from a sealed (Valve Regulated) lead acid battery which could be either AGM or GEL type.

[lkruper]

I found a numax catalog at thebatterycentreeversham co uk that lists the very battery and specs it says bench charging 8ah. It is a marine dual purpose 113 c20 and mca800a .

I'm confused as I got lead calcium dual purpose agm and take 22ah max charge and they only 90a c20.

I always look at the manufacturer's recommendation and I find that AGMs don't all have the same recommendations. In fact, I don't think I would buy a battery without first approving of the level of information in the technical guide and understanding it first.

[Raul]

I found a numax catalog at thebatterycentreeversham co uk that lists the very battery and specs it says bench charging 8ah. It is a marine dual purpose 113 c20 and mca800a .

I'm confused as I got lead calcium dual purpose agm and take 22ah max charge and they only 90a c20.

[lkruper]

My bad , just seed the charging table for this batt . Max bench charging is 8ah . So that would be ok with one panel.

Are you saying that one should not charge this battery any higher than 8 amps? His existing charge controller will exceed that. That seems very low, not even 0.1C. I am concerned that this might not be enough to fully charge with solar in one day, and the new battery will sit at < 100% charge for days at a time and sulfate again.

[Raul]

That numax is a dual purpose lead calcium agm rated for starting and deep cycle , it will gobble atleast 20a .

My bad , just seed the charging table for this batt . Max bench charging is 8ah . So that would be ok with one panel.

[spoon]

Unless your CC is not working, I don't think you will gain that much with just one panel.

Ah, sorry yes... I have the other panel also ordered.

[lkruper]

Yes, at the moment I can only afford ot change the CC. The Numax is C20... (I do have 2 of them though)

Also, I don't think it is AGM... Just sealed Lead Acid.

Unless your CC is not working, I don't think you will gain that much with just one panel.

[spoon]

Are you still going to have a 110AH 12v battery? With one panel, you can get 250/12 = 21 amps. With inefficiencies maybe 17 or so. That is 0.15C for your 110AH battery. 10% is safe and some AGMs like 0.2 to 0.3, but if yours is not one of them, you could be pumping too many amps in to your battery at peak sun production. I would call the manufacturer and make sure you know the limits of your battery.

Yes, at the moment I can only afford ot change the CC. The Numax is C20... (I do have 2 of them though)

Also, I don't think it is AGM... Just sealed Lead Acid.

[lkruper]

That numax is a dual purpose lead calcium agm rated for starting and deep cycle , it will gobble atleast 20a .

Do you know how long the battery needs to be in absorb? For example, Concorde Lifeline AGMs need at least 2 hours after bulk. If this was Lifeline and he used 20% of his capacity (22 AH) it would take with one panel, 22/17 + 2 hrs or 3.5 hours of insolation. But he only gets 1.6 (in Cornwall in winter). If he had two panels and doubled the amps it would be 22/30 + 2 = 2.7 hours. Much better but still short of filling the battery in winter, and that is only if the battery can take 30 amps. 30 amps is 0.27C and if this battery was a Concorde AGM 0.3 would be fine.

[Raul]

That numax is a dual purpose lead calcium agm rated for starting and deep cycle , it will gobble atleast 20a .

[lkruper]

I think your estimations are pretty close to be honest. Lets say the higher end to be safe at 300wh. My Isolation values are 4.68 in July and 1.13 in Dec. Now, those figues are for SW England and I am as far South West as you can get. So mine will actually be slightly higher than that but lets go with those. By your calculations then I should be looking to get 565wh (500w x 1.13) even in winter... Accounting for losses, I should still be getting my 300wh needs, yeh?

This is provided I change to the better CC, 2 panels and my batterys are good.

I think i'm going to go with the victron bluesolar 100/30 http://store.meadotech.com/#!/BlueSo...egory=13042968 So that I'm definately covered for 2x 250w panels.

Are you still going to have a 110AH 12v battery? With one panel, you can get 250/12 = 21 amps. With inefficiencies maybe 17 or so. That is 0.15C for your 110AH battery. 10% is safe and some AGMs like 0.2 to 0.3, but if yours is not one of them, you could be pumping too many amps in to your battery at peak sun production. I would call the manufacturer and make sure you know the limits of your battery.